Meth or P related - it goes here, please.

[Keys]

What are you doing this Thursday PC?

Am flying up there for the course. PM me if you want further details.

[Glenn]

^^ I like the "reasonable cleaning" phrase.

Since you have completed the "P" testing course, do you include a meth test report in the TA? Otherwise, how can you prove that the property was clean at the start of the tenancy?

On our ingoing inspection reports we have migrated more than once from this and that specialist inspection program and are now right back to using Word. We insert a picture of the test cartridge which clearly shows the two lines in red. I was a bit worried at first that the second line was rather faint in a few cases. What you learn on the course is this faint line still indicates a negative test. Like the contamination is less than 0.5 Micro grams.

So yes we have the tenants sign three times that there is no P.
Once on the main body of the TA that states no P. (separately initialed)
Second on the special conditions of the TA.
Third on the ingoing inspection.

What I have not yet progressed to is doing between tenancy tests when we do the regular three monthlies. The reason for this is there is no facility in the RTA to actually achieve an eviction for using drugs in a property. The test for an eviction is a publicly notified conviction in the district court. Just getting a conviction in the district court is not sufficient because the public do not have access to the judgements in the District Court. The Rt Hon Judith Minister of justice was working towards getting that access but since she was replaced the promise seems to have faded into the forgotten realm.
The other issue as I have mentioned several times that I have not progressed to is urine, blood, saliva, and hair drug tests.
I will let others walk on the red hot fires of controversy before rushing in where fools fear do their thing.

[Keys]

Just a piss take question Glenn.

Do you use the standard government TA and inspection form?

[wemoon]

quick comment on the $15 immediate results testing - basically A WASTE OF TIME - see the stats

[Kirwee]

Maybe there's a need to start a business with a drug sniffer dog for a first indication of meth or pot.
Friendly, reliable, and cuddly afterwards too.

[wemoon]

yes good thought - as an ex Police Dog Handler (although so far back almost a previous life) it would be great - but TENANTS rights etc and the logistics of getting the 'stuff' to train the dog(s) would need to be Police supervised

[Perry]

The reason for this is there is no facility in the RTA to actually achieve an eviction for using drugs in a property.

In your experience, Glenn, and presuming that the drug concerned is illegal, how does that stack up against this section?

(2) The tenant shall not—

(b) use the premises, or permit the premises to be used, for any unlawful purpose;

(3A) The following are declared to be unlawful acts:
(c) a contravention of subsection (2)(b):

The way you put it, seems that an unlawful act of that nature by a tenant is just a wet-bus-ticket-slap-type offence.

[Glenn]

In your experience, Glenn, and presuming that the drug concerned is illegal, how does that stack up against this section?




The way you put it, seems that an unlawful act of that nature by a tenant is just a wet-bus-ticket-slap-type offence.

The issue Perry is that it matters little what a modestly intelligent person understands the RTA to mean.
I speak on the basis of multi failures to use that section of the RTA.
The adjudicators can make any ruling they see is equitable and get away with it.
There is no sensible process to challenge their decisions so the answer is to simply work out another way to achieve what we want.
The problem is deciding what I want.
Now that is the question.
Do you know what I want.
What do you want.
When pushed really hard I have to agree.
One simple answer for all difficult questions.

GIVE ME THE MONEY

[Glenn]

quick comment on the $15 immediate results testing - basically A WASTE OF TIME - see the stats

Now my goodness. I have heard multiple opinions of the various testing techniques.
I now have a certificate to say I am qualified to do surface contamination testing using two different types of tests. One of these is via Hills Lab.
The purpose of this forum is to test the ideas that are floating around.
Please for my and everyone else's sake. Can you lay your cards on the table.
What tests what statistics.

[Keys]

What tests what statistics.

Carried out by whom?

[Glenn]

Carried out by whom?

This was an ex Police dog handler. What does that tell one about a new person on PT with three posts to his name.
It is pretty obvious that the Meth business is big business.
We have seen similar scams being run with ventilation, insulation, personal alarms, weight loss pills, and plastic bottles on front lawns to stop dogs crapping.

[Glenn]

On the subject of Meth testing with a "Test-4-Meth" kit.
One of our landlords asked me today if she could test for Meth during the tenancy. Does she need to advise the tenant she is going to do this in addition to the normal 48 hours notice of inspection.

My advise was to not do it.
What are you going to do if you get a positive I said.
if you do nothing you might be fined $7500 or more for letting the poor tenant live in a contaminated property.
Or if you go to the Police they can not do anything because they can only prosecute someone caught smoking it or holding a useable amount of drugs for use or sale.
If you go to the tribunal they are not permitted to decide if a tenant has been doing something illegal. That is the function of the District Court. So there would be no grounds for termination or in fact any other action.
You will also be in trouble with your insurance company.
So really the only thing you can do is look for drug utensils when doing the regular inspection and if you find them issue a 90 day notice. If they are on a fixed term do not renew their lease and then do the test after they are out.

What do others of you think?

[Bob Kane]

On the subject of Meth testing with a "Test-4-Meth" kit.
One of our landlords asked me today if she could test for Meth during the tenancy. Does she need to advise the tenant she is going to do this in addition to the normal 48 hours notice of inspection.

So really the only thing you can do is look for drug utensils when doing the regular inspection and if you find them issue a 90 day notice. If they are on a fixed term do not renew their lease and then do the test after they are out.

What do others of you think?

I think you should do the meth test during the regular inspection and if you get a positive then issue the 90 day notice.

[Wayne]

I think you should do the meth test during the regular inspection and if you get a positive then issue the 90 day notice.

But only if you did a test prior to the tenancy starting.

[Glenn]

I

think you should do the meth test during the regular inspection and if you get a positive then issue the 90 day notice.
But only if you did a test prior to the tenancy starting.

Good comments and thoughts. I am inclined to agree with Wayne on that count. So what you are saying do not wait till you see the drug utensils just test test test. (at your cost)
I must admit with P I hardly ever (no make that never) see utensils unlike the use of oil.

So thinking through the prepared plan what do you do after getting the Positive P test on the "Test-4-Meth" positive (but not the swab test and report back from Hills Lab) and you then issue the 90 day notice.
What steps does one do once you have this slightly enraged innocent pleading tenant out. I wonder what you will say to yourself and the departed tenant after say 100 days have elapsed and they have "CLEANED" the flat and you can not now get a positive on your precursor test kit?

Oh bugger what now!
Don't forget that you can not run the risk of advertising the flat to let during the 90 day period. Because goodness me you might need a bit of time between tenancies to clean it or even run the risk of a nasty fine for putting someone into a flat that is contaminated. So you are going to suffer perhaps 4 to 6 weeks lost rent between tenants all of which might have been a red herring.