Lawyers

[xris]

For my own interest I recently looked at my experience with lawyers.

Of the last ten or so that I have had dealings with I was a little surprised to find that my satisfaction rate was very low, with only one being ‘acceptable’.

When I say ‘experience’ I mean anything from fully instructing and dealing with a lawyer to cursory encounters, but in most cases it is the former.

I was really quite surprised to realise that there was a roughly 10% success rate, and I could not help but reflect on the difference between lawyers and
RE agents.

For some strange reason lawyers as a rule seem immune from criticism. I could elaborate on this at length but time forbids that now.

Anyway, I thought I’d ask for any comments on this from others.

I am however very aware of the dangers in asking people this because of the likelihood that it will degenerate into gossip and unsubstantiated mud slinging – the sort of thing I take an active part in refuting when people do it about RE agents.

Here is one example from me to start off with.

I bought a house on Friday and the vendors did not leave till Monday. They were in a difficult personal situation and chose to vent their frustration on me. They were very, very, rude and when they did finally leave they left the place in a less than satisfactory condition.

I contacted them via their lawyer for recompense. I had a curse written reply from their lawyer saying I had no claim against them and because of this he would advise them to ignore my claim, which they did, except to contact me telling me where to go, and repeating what their lawyer had said that they owed me nothing.

A month later these vendors were out of pocket with a court order against them. Their lawyer seems not to understand the S&P agreement and had been advising them incorrectly.

Only one side of the story I know, but when added to the many others there does seem to be a pattern emerging.

Why are lawyers held in such high regard when I can see little reason for this?

xris

[payjisan]

Very interesting thread xris. I am also having issues with a Vendor (who’s lawyer happens to be his daughter!) and my experience so far is that every communication from their side seems to avoid answering any of the questions our lawyer has posed to them. Instead at every step they have been confrontational and repeatedly insisted that we have no claim against them (when common sense and a thing called contract law would clearly suggest otherwise) and have said that legal action is now our only recourse.

This would be my third property transaction and the first slightly ugly experience. So why would these people prefer to write letters full of bang and bluster and use “Sue us” to resolve seemingly trivial (and usually straightforward) matters? Well all I can think of is that it keeps them busy writing letters and clocking up the hours to bill their clients. Perhaps it is done so often now that most of the time they don’t expect the other side to actually proceed with legal action? In your case you quite rightly have and the Vendor will no doubt lose and be liable for costs.

I think also lawyers try to ‘interpret’ the law a bit too much as well, when usually it is black and white. Again, it keeps them in a job though doesn’t it.

[ActionMan]

Hi xris

I commend you on taking the vendors to court. I would probably not have done so unless it was a considerable sum. So well done.

As usual 20/80 rule I think applies. 20% of lawyers are dealing with 80% of the property transaction and so would be knowledgable in this area.

Maybe having a property settlement service specialising only in this area would be a solution. I heard that Australia has this sort of organization?

Aisea.

[cube]

they don’t expect the other side to actually proceed with legal action?

And if you do proceed, the clock keeps ticking.......

[Gypsygirl]

finally

Thanks Xris,
I truly thought it must just be me.
There seems to be a pattern, not only of that type of thing, but also more basic things such as lack of contact, with you doing all the chasing to establish information.
Also when it comes to preemptive advice it seems to be thin on the ground, I would have hoped that part of their job is advising you on what could go wrong rather than letting you do something and then telling you what you should have done.
I'm up to number 5 and hoping this one turns out to be better than the last 4.

[spaceman]

pppfffffttttttbbbbp

Why are lawyers held in such high regard when I can see little reason for this?

xris

Hi regard???? .....speak for yourself mate .....Having had a bit of an inside peak at some of their workings, I would rank most of them little better than blood-sucking leeches.

Except of course my lawyer if he's reading this ... top bloke him!!

Cheers
Spaceman

[LondonKiwi]

I have used the same lawyer for four property transactions and I have the utmost respect for him.

He even asked around the office on his own accord when I was looking at buying a property off a developer that he had not heard of. He subsequently found that this developer was not ethical in previous transactions and suggested I not proceed or proceed with caution. His fears were realised but I had a subsequent clause in my contract so that I could exit.

So my dealings have been particularly good.

LK

[xris]

Hi regard???? .....speak for yourself mate .....

Cheers
Spaceman

Didn't say that's how I think...

[Perry]

Quite some time back, I asked why it was that lawyer's
fees were not tax deductible, although accountants, et
al, were deductibile. The legal profession also fought
against 'legal privilege' being extended to interaction
between a person and their accountant. Further, it must
be remembered that lawyers still have a protected
monopoly on legal representation in NZ.

I've also been amazed at the degree of subtle ostentation
in lawyers reception and waiting rooms. And also wondered
why there are no PayLess Law firms around. Ones where
substance and sharpness come before style.

Generally, I agree with the percentage comment that Xris
has made. Although I wonder if it's too generous, at times.

Those who have had good experiences need only one -
largely fatuous piece of advice - stick with them like a limpet.
And look ahead with dread to their retirement or a relocation.