Ring Fencing Matters

[Lanthanide]

You mean the position where Labour + Greens is steadily drawing even with National? And that NZ First has more policy in common with L+G than National? And that 77% of NZ First voters polled by HorizonPoll preferred a coalition agreement with Labour?

Sounds like a pretty good position for Labour to be in, really, compared to the last 3 elections.

[Perry]

. . . now a dead duck.

Labour? CGT? Both?

[Beano]

So you are raising rents when costs haven't gone up - so rents don't bear any relationship to costs?
Rents are based on supply and demand not cost plus.

Outgoings are cost plus
Rentals are demand driven (except where there is a ratchet )

[Anthonyacat]

you can do anything you want, if you're willing to take the risk of an IRD audit.

Well, if we're going to bring the option of tax fraud into the equation, this whole thread doesn't matter much. Just declare your income as something other than property, and they'll let the losses through.

Your point on available for rent at a higher price is a good one. It wouldn't fly long term I don't think, but seems to meet the criteria on a literal level.

[flyernzl]

Judging by the comments in the Herald, sharebrokers and investment advisers are in favour of Little's policy.

[Anthonyacat]

Funny, that...

I have to say, from the perspective of reweighting the NZ attitude away from property, this is probably a good move. As would be the occasional compulsory land acquisition from the government from private investors, or introducing a stamp duty or annual land tax on the value of land that home owners are exempt from. None of these are good moves from pretty much any other perspective, but to reduce our investment weighting in property? It'd help.

[Wayne]

Outgoings are cost plus
Rentals are demand driven (except where there is a ratchet )

Generally here we are talking residential rather than commercial.

[flyernzl]

Funny, that...

I have to say, from the perspective of reweighting the NZ attitude away from property, this is probably a good move.

Given the quite appalling record of the NZ financial industry in charging exorbitant fees while destroying the wealth of those who invest with them, what suitable alternatives are available for private investors with, say, $100K to invest?

My wife came into some money quite a while ago.
She 'invested' one third with Bridgecorp - all gone.
She 'invested' one third with the then ownership company of the NZ Herald - almost all gone.
She 'invested' one third into a block of three flats in Auckland - now has quite a nice little income from those rents.

[Wayne]

I invested quite a lot in a handfull of shares - apart from a certain mine on the West Coast they have done very well thanks.
Around 15% year on year.

[flyernzl]

Its not capital appreciation we oldies want.
Its income, to pay the constant and unavoidable daily expenses of house rates, insurance, grocery bill and the wine account.
I have a few thousand shares in one of the electricity companies. The six-monthly dividend from those give me enough to lunch out - provided I lunch alone and don't have second helpings.

[Anthonyacat]

I've got a share portfolio myself, across 20+ listed companies. 2017 dividend yield on total cost was 6.98%, on market value 6.57%. If only the 18 dividend-paying stocks are included in the denominator, it's 9.53% on cost and 7.83% on market.

2017 wasn't actually a great year for overall returns, as I had a bit of Wynyard and also Intueri, but positives happen too - both TradeMe and Z Energy have gone very well since purchase as have the energy companies.

It is a shame the dividends only come in every 6 months though. You feel incredibly rich in March/April and September/October but the rest of the year you get almost nothing.

[Wayne]

Its not capital appreciation we oldies want.
Its income, to pay the constant and unavoidable daily expenses of house rates, insurance, grocery bill and the wine account.
I have a few thousand shares in one of the electricity companies. The six-monthly dividend from those give me enough to lunch out - provided I lunch alone and don't have second helpings.

My shares provide a dividend of around 8% average - more than enough for a lunch or 2.
Maybe you have the wrong shares?
Or it seems not enough - a few thousand shares isn't a lot.

[Perry]

Sounds like a pretty good position for Labour to be in, really, compared to the last 3 elections.

How quickly they all do forget.

Former Prime Minister David Lange is reputed to have described a capital gains tax as the sort of tax you introduce if you want to lose not just one election, but the next three!

I suspect that the next election outcome is going to be very messy, indeed.

We may even be heading for Italian-style parliaments, in the future.

[Perry]

I have to say, from the perspective of reweighting the NZ attitude away from property, this is probably a good move. As would be the occasional compulsory land acquisition from the government from private investors, or introducing a stamp duty or annual land tax on the value of land that home owners are exempt from. None of these are good moves from pretty much any other perspective, but to reduce our investment weighting in property? It'd help.

All of these measures being talked about are symptom-chasing - nothing more.

[Bobsyouruncle]

Messy P? It's hard to see anyhting but a National walkover with possibly Winston on the side. Labour have no show.