What is "average condition"? Rot and re-roofing?

[Cool]

Hi everyone, have been reading the forums here for quite a while but finally have a question I can't find the answer to.

In your opinion, what is "average condition" for an older house?

We have put an offer in on a 1950s house that seemed to be pretty average, only to find during the pre-purchase inspections that the bathroom walls and floorboards are really rotten (bathroom wall has dry rot right through to the master bedroom), and the original concrete tile roof is at the end of its life - I could see it was pretty eroded, but the roofer says there's no point in repairing the holes and cracked ridge caps because even if we did, more problems will keep coming and it will still need a new roof in a couple of years anyway. (The repairs would be about 40% of the cost of a full re-roof).

We found other stuff that I would have taken as "average" (e.g some of the wiring is from the 1970s and need rewiring), but after the inspection, I was expecting a bit of movement in the price given that the vendors claimed not to have known about the rotten bathroom when we first put in our offer, and they had no one else interested in their house except us.

However, when we asked the vendors to either remedy or lower the price a bit, they refused and said that the house is in average condition and the price reflects that.

I agree with them that the price reflects what I would have thought it should go for if it was in average condition. I just wouldn't have thought this was average condition. It needs about 20K of repairs just to keep it from deteriorating further. Most houses we have looked at seemed to need way less work. But... this is the first house we've actually gone through the due diligence process on, so I don't know - are all the other average houses out there hiding similar maintenance issues?

Is this really average? What do you think?

(The house is in Whangarei, if that makes any difference).

[Courham]

If your conditions included a satisfactory building inspection/report then I'd be walking away- you are opening yourself up for a whole lot of expensive work- probably a lot more than you initially think. so unless you want to sink money into a doer upper find something with less work needed.

Last house I bought the insurance company was a royal pain in the arse over the age of the rewiring and was a major hassle getting it sorted so they'd give me full insurance, finally found a sparky who played ball and didn't need a full rewire just enough of the old crap to meet the insurance companies requirements.

Craig

[John the builder]

the builders report is your out if you dont accept the condition it reveals and the vendor wont make good your concerns.then you have a back out option.

The vendor is entitled to hold out for his price and was under no obligation regards the condition but you were entitled to have a go to get the price reduced.

"Caveat-emptor" still appli8es

the vendor agent now must disclose to nect interested party?? Could be interesting sitiation?

If I was vendopr I would fix add the cost to the reserve and go back to market.

[Cool]

Thanks for the replies.

The vendor is entitled to hold out for his price and was under no obligation regards the condition but you were entitled to have a go to get the price reduced.
"Caveat-emptor" still appli8es

Yeah, that's how I see it too. I have no problem with any of that, and am now under no obligations about this house.

I'm just posting to see what people's views of an "average condition" might be, more for future reference than anything else. Trying to decide whether what has happened is how things usually play out in the provinces or not.

If I was vendopr I would fix add the cost to the reserve and go back to market.

So would I; will be interesting to see if they do that. The median house price in Whangarei has mostly been going sideways, outside of coastal, though, so wonder if that would work for them.

Last house I bought the insurance company was a royal pain in the arse over the age of the rewiring and was a major hassle getting it sorted so they'd give me full insurance, finally found a sparky who played ball and didn't need a full rewire just enough of the old crap to meet the insurance companies requirements.

There's a lot of difference between insurance companies, too. We phoned a bunch about this house and some wouldn't touch it at all until a partial rewire, while others were happy to take the money but had a clause that it wouldn't be covered for "pre-existing" conditions (so if they can say that the wiring made it catch fire, no payout). That's interesting about finding the right electrician.

[DazRaz]

I have 3 houses of that age and none of them have issues like that. It sounds like it is half a step off being inhabitable. If purchase price + repair cost doesn't work with a safety margin walk away.

[Cool]

I have 3 houses of that age and none of them have issues like that.

Good to know.

[Maccachic]

Thinks its a Do'er upper not average condition.

[John the builder]

surely 'average' means just that; a mix of good and bad that together evens out to something sufficient?
also dictionary Collins average 7. "mediocre or inferior".

This would be a fair description of the house in this case?

[PTILoveYou]

When the word "average" is used to mention condition, it usually means poor!

[Cool]

Well, I am definitely not looking for a do-up at the moment. I am after a first investment and don't want to start in the "deep end". It sounds like I might have to look in a lower price bracket if most houses I look at are going to be like this one.

But I've just realised that I'm really asking two different things here, 1: what does "average" mean and 2: what is normal/usual in the older houses you look at?

When the word "average" is used to mention condition, it usually means poor!

Ha ha real estate speak eh? They only downgraded it to "average" when talking to us - their ad still says "very good condition" which gave me a laugh.

[John the builder]

Well, I am definitely not looking for a do-up at the moment

.

you pay for what you get; buy new and excellent condition but everything else is subject to wear and tear depending on age, and yes that means some decay. You either upgrade or maintain the present condition or allow to deteriorate and rebuild when the time is right.

There is real value in an exsiting older property because the replacement cost is so high for new. You actually missed a bargain because your offer didnt reflect the actual condition

[NomoneyNotalk]

Depends on the price, we usually can find bargains from do up properties. Just make sure all problems are found. If you think the repair cost plus house price is too much, you can cancel your offer.

And it is hard to say what is average. Don't worry about that.

[jimO]

last house i bought was in "average" condition, 4 bed brick with roughcast over the top, iron roof, all but 1 of the windows replaced with aluminium (inc 2 big bay windows) outside needs waterblasted and painted, inside needed complete redecoration, a few months ago i gutted the kitchen and bathroom, new kitchen, tiled walk in shower, renewed all the plumbing, fitted a gas instant hot water system. One of my boys is a tenant and he is half way through a building aprentiship and along with me is doing the work and eventually will buy the house off me or if he decides The old shitter cost $210000 and i have probably spent 20k on it