What is Phil Jones story

[Paul34]

Hi Everyone

I'm interested in knowing from Phil Jones, or anyone else, as to what is Phil's story in real estate is. I would like to position this by saying that this is nothing against RM or Phil I'm just interested as i realise I know little about what he really owns. I know his philosophy on ythe investment but not how it has played out for him.

I recently attended the Steve McNight pres. and have been most impressed by reading his resume and his pres., which
a) had NONE of the clappy-happy hype of most presentations.
b) Was VERY transparent. He said what he owned how much money in property he has, what he has owned, when he sold, his ups and downs, current income from property. This certainly made it easy to evaluate.
* These two points I would see as huge in the credibility stakes.

If Phil is mainly focussed on his business that is cool but I'm intrigued to know his story, given his postion as a guru in the NZ market.

I'm interested in this as well because at the one seminar i went to of his he stated VERY categorically that you should NEVER sell. This has been his message for a while. That is cool but this changed at the Steve McKnight pres. Now it is sell but make sure it is in the right vechile. However a month before he said in response to my question at a forum of 60 people.

Paul: "So when do you sell"
Phil: "You don't"
Paul: "But when do you sell"
Phil: "Which part of don't sell do you not get"

* He has also said in print words to this effect.

As Steve showed by selling on yeild you can divide then multiple. This may not be the intention when you buy which is to hold forever but who could have predicted the rise in prices and less rise in rents. Situations change.

Again, I have no issue with RM or Phil who I think have done a fantastic job in NZ at passing the message. I'm just interested in knowing his story. Property over the last little while has ALOT to do with when you started and WHAT strategy you could use in 1999-2000 is different now so Phil's story would help me understand the manifestation of the philosophy in a NZ market.

For those published in his book thanks for telling your story.

Paul

[toby]

Hi Paul 34,
Sorry I'm not anybody involved with RM or ESC, but I wanted to share an insight with you I recently gained after attending a bootcamp in the US recently.
The presenter Ron Legrand had been in the game for around twenty years and teaching for the last 15.
He is one of the top most popular teachers there.
His focus is trading and buying without using your own money - quick turning.
To put things into perspective he has done arouind 2000 deals, and yes there are the correct amount of zeros!
He makes millions upon millions a year teaching others (even owns his own jet!).

The insight was, and I quote:

" I have made more money out of information marketing than I have out of real estate up until the last 12 months when I started doing developing/commercial deals and in the last 12 months I have made more money than in all those years combined"

Hmmmm.... made me think.

To put it another way - sometimes the sizzle sells better than the sausage -but it really depends on what the sausage is.

Also from the reasearch I've done, I have yet to find a full time investor (that still buys regulary) that either A) Does not trade or B) Has not got another business or job for cashflow.
I can't think of any, - do you, or anyone else know anyone (that's been in the game for more than two years)?

Sure there may be some who do not have a business or job now, but I bet in the earlier years they did - if there is anyone out there, who are they - I want to meet you.

It's another distinction I got after much reasearch and it lead me straight back to Robert Kiyoski's teachings.

Also I wanted to get your feedback on this to.
If you sold and made $20,000 gross, how much rent would you have to collect to make that?
And another point just came to mind - of course Phil & Dave sell - What on earth is their website hotproperty deals or what ever it's called about?
Sure they may not be "trading" but it's the business of selling contracts over houses they may not take title or be IRD traders however in essence that's just splitting hairs.

Just some thoughts because I'm bored sitting at home.

[duvetray]

there seem to be alot of non gurus, people who have seen a gap in the market to teach and earn money from the Public when property is a hot topic in the media, i would never front with Seminar money unless i knew the ""Guru"
a) had different experiences than me in RE investing
b) had a track record that included more than the boom years of RE investing of post year 99/2000 and hade made moeny in the pre boom years as well.

then you would have to weigh up how you could build their knowledge into your current strategy, a copycat system will only have a short term success

[whitt]

Property over the last little while has ALOT to do with when you started and WHAT strategy you could use in 1999-2000 is different now so Phil's story would help me understand the manifestation of the philosophy in a NZ market.

Rather than get into a discussion on Richmastery and their place in New Zealands Investment seminar market. I will answer Paul's original post, The story behind Phil.

-In the big picture they are not long term investors and have not invested through several property cycles. In fact only starting Pre the last boom.
-They used Investment property to build their wealth in the early years (pre boom)
-Before moving onto putting their time and effort into Richmastery the business. Where most the time was spent running seminars and expanding.
-David has moved into KPI mag side of business whilst Phil now concentrates on Richmastery.
-David Howe does not believe in the "never sell" method. Infact he currently has a apartment at the Nautilus up for sale. http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Pr...n-31077579.htm . He and Phil purchased from the Richmastery Property Deals web site off the Plan a while back.

Phil If I have missed anything or if you would like to post on how you got started and when etc we would all like to hear.

[drelly]

This is a really good question because so many "gurus" are really lacking in transparency. Kiyosaki would have to be a classic example. There has been so much written by and about him both for and against and still no one seems to know what his real story is!

[whitt]

Also from the reasearch I've done, I have yet to find a full time investor (that still buys regulary) that either A) Does not trade or B) Has not got another business or job for cashflow.
I can't think of any, - do you, or anyone else know anyone (that's been in the game for more than two years)?

Sure there may be some who do not have a business or job now, but I bet in the earlier years they did - if there is anyone out there, who are they - I want to meet you.

You are quite correct Toby I can't think of any either. Prehaps they all got bored of being retired millionaires at the age of 35.
Personally I could not stop working as I would go insane. But instead would spend more time in something i enjoy. I suppose you could say the bussiness or job would be a hobby.

[ESC]

.

Hi Guys,

Could we suggest that the best way to know Phils story is to just meet him at one of our events and ask him rather than getting 3rd party information here. He tells his story at the start of many of the evening seminars.

I think its important to understand the "context" of the following:

Paul: "So when do you sell"
Phil: "You don't"
Paul: "But when do you sell"
Phil: "Which part of don't sell do you not get"

Richmastery fully supports and teaches "trading" property but we focus on "investing" which is largely buy and holding in a balanced portfolio and equity recycling to buy more property.

Steve McKnight teaches trading property. This is a process which we fully support hence Steves involvement in the Richmastery Property Academy and our promotion of his 1 day events.

The rules for "trading" and "investing" in property are very different with the IRD and if an investor is not careful they can taint their entire "investing" portfolio through "trading" unless they have the correct asset protection structure setup.

Australia has a simpler arrangement where you can do anything you like with property as long as you pay capital gain tax when you sell. This enables investors that are Australian Residents (like Steve McKnight) to treat trading and investing as the same activity because it can be done in the same structure.

Finally, Steve has acheived investing success "trading" property, Phil has achieved it "investing" in property. Both have a positive outcome but have focused on slightly different strategies. We see this as wholesome and encouraging for investors.

Hope this helps

[toby]

Hi Richmastery,
Looking at the posts it is obvious that many would care to read what Phil's story is without having to pay to hear it.
I have seen Phil and Dave speak myself a number of years ago and have attended Brad's school and have an understanding of their background, yet as you say - rather than listen to 3rd party info, it would make more sense to hear it from the horses mouth here on this site.
Opportunity knocks...

[whitt]

Re: .

Hi Guys,

Could we suggest that the best way to know Phil's story is to just meet him at one of our events and ask him rather than getting 3rd party information here. He tells his story at the start of many of the evening seminars.

Or better still just post your story here Phil 1st party. How and when you got started etc....
If people knew your background that may encourage them to a seminar.

Many successful investors have shared their story here on what got them to where they are today.
Try reading Orion or Gems story. They tell some amazing stories. Whilst not their intention, I am sure them sharing their stories have helped out their business.

[Cliffy]

He tells his story at the start of many of the evening seminars.

I went to an evening seminar and heard about 1 deal from Phil.

I too would love to hear the full story.

[Paul34]

Some clarity

Well it seems I may not be the only one with this interest.

Just for some clarity.

1) I have asked this question at an evening presentation (actually sat.) but did not get a complete reply. This is fair because it would suck up too much time to run through an ENTIRE investing cycle in one of those presentations when the point is different.

2) It is not an attacking question. I like what RM have done AND like their turn around on WRAPS and basically think they are better than most unis in what they do. It may not be for me but for those just starting they could do worse then attend this. This said how hard is it to run through what you actually done and when. Moreover as i said to Phil I find RM which aims to attact new people each seminar far more benefical than a mag that says the same thing every month with a large adverteriol section. Again however KPI helped me initally but now there is only so many ways and times you can say the same thing.

3) Now I are confused: What is there std position. The key issue is that to invest you need to sell or top up from other equity. Therefore I'm interested in how Phil's philosophy works in practice. At the forementioned seminar he said he had sold only two properties to fund the split between KPI and RM and his business partner.

4) If you do need a secobdary income source than this needs to be clear. Steve made this super clear by saying that that is how he funds his depoists. That level of transparency is refreshing.

5) it is not an either or. No one is saying sell all your property. What they are saying is that circumstances change and it makes sense to sell and reinvest to keep velocity of money. The decision however when you buy is that you keep for the long haul. If we knew we would have 100% growth in prop we would have all brought more houses. The fact it happened is rare.

6) i heard a radio interview with Phil years ago and again he did not answer how much he had.

Nice to see I'm not the only one.

? Is how can you invest without selling, especially in the current market. You will top out equity quickly. The maths of buying at a discount and selling and above retail seems pretty simple if the conditions suffice.

[Dean@Massiveaction]

I have absolutely no vested interest in Richmastery but I seem to spend a lot of time defending them. Hope you all won't mind if I say this.
If Phil chooses to keep his life to himself then that is his prerogative. HE gets tall poppied so often I wouldn't be divulging my situation if I was him either. You only have to listen to him for a relatively short time to know that he really knows what he's talking about. He's no "those who can't do teach" type of gurus. I've heard him relay so many stories now he's either the real deal or the best liar I've ever heard.
When you get a significant portfolio there are lots of reasons why you'd keep that to yourself, IRD for a start.
So can I once again suggest we will get a lot further in life if we learn from those who are successful and celebrate their success and understand their human weakness, and keep our noses out of uninvited orifices unless they are volunteered for our inspection.

And on teh never sell thing, that will always be influenced by circumstances. i know of a Richmastery situation where someone bought a commercial building for 1mil. Before they settled they were offered 1.6mil and contemporaneous settlement. They sold, who wouldn't!!

[cube]

Re: What is Phil Jones story

Paul: "So when do you sell"
Phil: "You don't"
Paul: "But when do you sell"
Phil: "Which part of don't sell do you not get"

I saw Brad Sugars on the RM DVD say exactly the same thing, and then on an RM/KPI CD, talk about how had recently being selling a non-performing property.

Which part of "you don't sell" doesn't he understand?

cube

[Tucker]

Hi
I think highly of RM and have learnt a considerable amount from them enabling me to become a full time property investor.

Why would Phil need to sell. RM charge $50 a month for membership and I would say they have 1000's of members. If the had 10,000 members that's $500,000 a month, $6,000,000 a year. Now that's a lot of deposits.

[ESC]

.

Hi Guys,

We appreciate the interest you have shown in Richmastery.

I have confirmed with Phil this morning that he has agreed to clear his diary so he can chat live online with you this Thursday night at 7.30pm in the Richmastery Chatroom to answer questions.

The Chatroom address is: http://www.richmastery.com/nz/Chatroom/default.aspx

This will provide a live interactive environment where concepts can be explained and clarification sort in a speedy and efficient manner.