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  1. #11

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    Tenant said unsure how the tap was running, maybe something flipped leaning on the tap and resulted the tap on.
    Last edited by hacona; 19-05-2019 at 12:28 PM.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    8,296

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    Quote Originally Posted by hacona View Post
    Tenant said unsure how the tap was running, maybe something flipped leaning on the tap and resulted the tap on.
    F**k's sake, they just need to own up.

    If this goes to the TT, they could potentially argue that it was an accident, so they don't have to pay.
    Squadly dinky do!

  3. #13

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    you are right.

    I called tenancy line, they said the landlord pays everything including excess fee and related agent fee if the landlord can't approve if it is careless damage. Refer to "Osaki" case.

    I asked "this is the second accident in two weeks, shows the patent of careless. Can the landlord apply for terminating the fix term tenancy?" They said "no, only if the tenant agreed with it."

    I asked, "If the tenant disagreed and upset, again accidentally left tap running and house flooded Who pays?" they answered, "the landlord pays."

    I said, "but the landlord hasn't done anything wrong, why the landlord has to pay?" they answered, "if the landlord cannot agreed, apply to the tribunal."

    How vulnerable the landlords are! They can be easily shattered to pieces simply by the amulet of "careless" .
    Last edited by hacona; 19-05-2019 at 12:34 PM.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hibiscus Coast
    Posts
    1,790

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    Quote Originally Posted by Davo36 View Post
    Can't work out if you're the owner or the property manager in this case?

    Yes, sad that so many are selling up. I don't blame them 1 bit though.
    Owner of the property, usually manage it myself but letting agent who then became property manager got an extra $40 week rent so decided to release myself (and husband) from the stress of looking after the property and new tenants.
    Property manager deflected the bond refund decision advising us both that as we couldn't agree on the amount to be deducted from the bond refund the best avenue was the TT. Tenant told adjudicator that I had sacked her! I told her and adjudicator that I hadn't as PM still had bond registered in her companies name.
    I wasn't paying any fees currently as the house is empty being fixed up from her damage. As far as I'm concerned she's still the PM, no letter ever set to say otherwise.
    PM actually sitting on the fence, if it goes against us will have a crack at her for the management fees paid. Very disappointed in her management, she believed the lies the tenant told her, and then found her another rental of a property she also manages. Some other poor landlord has this tenant, wish I could alert them!

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hibiscus Coast
    Posts
    1,790

    Default

    If you go to the TT with a tenant, will record of that hearing show up when a check is done on that tenant for another property?

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hibiscus Coast
    Posts
    1,790

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    I read with the insurance excess that some landlords had increased their excesses to $1000 or more so that if the tenant was found liable and the landlord awarded costs for the excess it allowed them a greater amount which could cover other damage. The adjudicator at our hearing supposedly likes to try and even things out to be fair, however, he did say that if the damage could be proved to have been caused by the tenant then there was a higher chance of being given the cost of the excess awarded.
    In my case I had a photo from 4 Dec showing some wear (created on 26 Sept when they moved in as not there before but no photos just previous tenants letter - he's insurance broker) and then a photo taken on 25 Feb when they moved out with 2 holes in carpet. Could see brown backing on carpet. Still waiting on result of hearing as at today.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    904

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    Quote Originally Posted by hacona View Post
    you are right.

    I called tenancy line, they said the landlord pays everything including excess fee and related agent fee if the landlord can't approve if it is careless damage. Refer to "Osaki" case.

    I asked "this is the second accident in two weeks, shows the patent of careless. Can the landlord apply for terminating the fix term tenancy?" They said "no, only if the tenant agreed with it."

    I asked, "If the tenant disagreed and upset, again accidentally left tap running and house flooded Who pays?" they answered, "the landlord pays."

    I said, "but the landlord hasn't done anything wrong, why the landlord has to pay?" they answered, "if the landlord cannot agreed, apply to the tribunal."

    How vulnerable the landlords are! They can be easily shattered to pieces simply by the amulet of "careless" .
    You should lodge to TT as soon as possible, the tenant cannot have things flipping onto taps.
    It's good you have a fixed term tenancy so you can wait that out and not renew for another term.

    This is a reason why some investors prefer commercial property - the tenants are businesses and take on more responsibility, no TT.
    Or higher end residential - generally a better quality tenant.
    Or, short term rent by the room - more hands on but more control by the LL also.

  8. #18

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    Unfortunately, the High Court (not just the TT) is absolutely clear on this one.

    If it is accidental damage, the landlord pays. This includes any insurance excess.

    Just go to the TT search form here, enter 'Osaki' and 'excess' in the Keyword Search field, and read a few of the decisions.

    Second one I found - Reason 10.

    The High Court has held that the principle in Osaki applies to any insurance excess
    Also, it's probably worth noting any professional / commercial people posting on this thread who say that you should claim the insurance excess from the tenant.
    Last edited by BigWal_v2; 21-05-2019 at 04:17 PM. Reason: Added 'excess' to the keywords you should include in the search.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Hastings
    Posts
    14,757

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigWal_v2 View Post
    If it is accidental damage, the landlord pays. This includes any insurance excess.
    Avis, Budget, Europ, Hertz et al rental car companies next?
    With all the Draconian new laws for residential rental LLs, perhaps AirBnB would be better? To avoid any hassle in Hawke's Bay, consult Be My Hostess. Want a great looking concrete swimming pool in Hawke's Bay? Designer Pools will do the job for you!

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    904

    Default

    I would still pursue a case against the tenant with the TT.
    There are other costs besides insurance excess, including initial cleaning.
    The tenant won't like even to have to pay for that.
    And they might think they will have some black flag against their name.
    My main point is you don't want the tenant to think you are a pushover. They may even turn apologetic and make some good in order to try and have a new term of tenancy? Not that you would want that but let them think otherwise.
    Yes it kinda sucks that residential tenants have all the protection but that's the kind of country we live in.
    Learn from this and develop a stringent tenant screening process. Choose your tenants and properties very carefully. You are operating a business and that's the way the TT sees it.

    If your tenants are also a business (commercial) then it's a different beast. No TT.


 

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