Ring Fencing Matters

[artemis]

So it's definitely not in - that's interesting Ross more so as there was a lot of commentary on it being a done deal and applying from 1 April 19.

Can it pass into law and be back dated - i.e. bought in some time in this financial year to apply from this financial year onwards?

cheers,

Donna

The Bill is in the Select Committee stage so we will have to see what the SC reports back to the House. The Bill contains other proposed legislation as well, notably payment of GST by overseas suppliers. Yes, can be backdated.

If ring-fencing of losses is passed the government will get a bump in revenue first few years but that will ease off in time as properties and portfolios break even and use up losses carried forward. The break even point will be delayed or brought forward if for example interest rates rise / fall and if landlords do more / less upgrading. And overall tax revenue from the policy will rise fall if the rental pool increases / decreases.

Landlords can't do much about interest rates, but otherwise they can and will make decisions that make sense to them.

[artemis]

The Bill that includes ring-fencing of rental losses is in third reading. To illustrate how little some MPs understand this section of the Bill and its implications, yet seem completely confident in voting on the Bill, the following is from Hansard yesterday -

KIRITAPU ALLAN (Labour):

Now, I listen to the Opposition, and they've been going on about how we don't, on this side of the House, understand the difference between speculators and mum and dad investors. Well, what we do understand is that there has been an immeasurable crisis in our housing terrain. I want to reference, in my neck of the woods, a small town up in rural New Zealand—a little town called Ōpōtiki. Now, up there we have—and it's well known in the community—particular people up in that community that are accruing and accumulating abundant, enormous amounts of housing stock. Much of those houses, they go untenanted. They are very poor quality, they go untenanted, they can ring-fence losses, and I'm talking not just in the tens or the 20s but far more than that, up into the 50s, I understand.

Now, what we're trying to do here is introduce a tax system that is fair. What we're trying to do here is say, actually, the taxpayers shouldn't bear the burden of enabling some of those people that have sought to rely on, basically, a taxpayer's tax cut for those that do want to speculate, that do want to ring-fence their losses.

It would be humorous if it wasn't so sad a reflection on our lawmakers.

[donna]

That's mental but it could be a blessing if there are more of these no hopers voting.

[flyernzl]

Somehow there seems to be a strong belief that having a tax loss makes you money!

[Perry]

But the gummint's concerned about its tax losses - no one else's.

[Don't believe the Hype]

The Bill that includes ring-fencing of rental losses is in third reading. To illustrate how little some MPs understand this section of the Bill and its implications, yet seem completely confident in voting on the Bill, the following is from Hansard yesterday -

KIRITAPU ALLAN (Labour):

Now, I listen to the Opposition, and they've been going on about how we don't, on this side of the House, understand the difference between speculators and mum and dad investors. Well, what we do understand is that there has been an immeasurable crisis in our housing terrain. I want to reference, in my neck of the woods, a small town up in rural New Zealand—a little town called Ōpōtiki. Now, up there we have—and it's well known in the community—particular people up in that community that are accruing and accumulating abundant, enormous amounts of housing stock. Much of those houses, they go untenanted. They are very poor quality, they go untenanted, they can ring-fence losses, and I'm talking not just in the tens or the 20s but far more than that, up into the 50s, I understand.

Now, what we're trying to do here is introduce a tax system that is fair. What we're trying to do here is say, actually, the taxpayers shouldn't bear the burden of enabling some of those people that have sought to rely on, basically, a taxpayer's tax cut for those that do want to speculate, that do want to ring-fence their losses.

It would be humorous if it wasn't so sad a reflection on our lawmakers.

What do you think this bloke did for a living before he became a politician?

What dismays me the most about our political system is that any fool can run for a seat in local or central government. Often they're the types we've all see at work who think they're far better at the job than others when in reality they're in the bottom 3rd.

On one hand I have to say... well i wouldn't want to do the job but on the other hand I can't be bothered listening to fools who you wouldn't hire to run a dairy

[Don't believe the Hype]

10 second google search... our friends at wikipedia

Allan was born in Te Karaka,^[3] of Ngāti Ranginui, Ngāti Tūwharetoa descent. She is part of a family of 10 children.^[4]
She dropped out of high school at 16. She worked at KFC in West Auckland and as a cherry picker.^[5]
She studied law and politics at Victoria University of Wellington.^[6] During her university studies she worked in an internship with then-Prime Minister Helen Clark.<sup>[1]


- didn't mention how well she went at studing law... sounds like a few concepts might have gone over the head but went to a few lectures</sup>

[AlFa]

10 second google search... our friends at wikipedia

Allan was born in Te Karaka,^[3] of Ngāti Ranginui, Ngāti Tūwharetoa descent. She is part of a family of 10 children.^[4]
She dropped out of high school at 16. She worked at KFC in West Auckland and as a cherry picker.^[5]
She studied law and politics at Victoria University of Wellington.^[6] During her university studies she worked in an internship with then-Prime Minister Helen Clark.<sup>[1]


- didn't mention how well she went at studing law... sounds like a few concepts might have gone over the head but went to a few lectures</sup>

Part-time fish-n-chips shop attendant is hiring KFC burger flippers. Sound about right to me...

[flyernzl]

Lawyer = arrogance and ignorance.

[Rosco]

I think there should be guidelines for our politicians

Prime Minister - should have guidelines about leadership and high level roles similar to a CEO of a large company.

MP's - At least something! Maybe completed 7th form (or whatever it is called now), worked in a small to medium sized business in NZ after they are 19 for at least a year, have life and work experience outside of unions and politics.

Unfortunately most people aren't interested in politics, so the political parties are full of no hopers. And then suddenly they are running the country :-(

Ross

[AlFa]

Unfortunately most people aren't interested in politics, so the political parties are full of no hopers. And then suddenly they are running the country :-(

Ross

Best talents always go to large private business - it's a career, money, high level of stress.
Average will be happy with smaller private and public sector.
Idiots go to politics as no one else is willing to do it

[Perry]

Yeah - the idiots are running the asylum.

[artemis]

Part-time fish-n-chips shop attendant is hiring KFC burger flippers. Sound about right to me...

Especially list MPs who meet more than one diversity requirement.

[Bluecoat]

Any group discounts for Apia ?

[flyernzl]

Afraid not.