The other side of this issue is that of the vendors. They want to get the best price they can for their asset, which won't happen if they are forced to accept a lower price solely because of the nationality or domicile of potential buyers. Not to mention the unintended consequences as structures are set up to get around this. Can't be that hard to do, and I'd bet potential buyers will be investigating options, given (a) the publicity (b) the xenophobia and (c) the possibility of legislation in future.
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I think that you are making a lot of assumptions and ignoring a lot of the facts in talking about 'capital' without looking at the NOT free market at work eri. The one most single flaw that I can see in your argument is that of manipualtion and distortion of the real market which occurs everywhere but nowhere more than is the US. These people are great business people and they load the tables all the time....in their favour.
You talk about how well the US is going but avoid talking about their debt, which they can never hope to repay. So what do they do? Print money to devalue their debt. It would not surprise me if the intention is to cause hyper inflation so that they never have to repay China for the money they borrowed. And in the meantime their industries become more competitive as the dollar drops. Great strategy. Corrupt behaviour though.
One of the things you miss about the US is that it has been so successful because it has been a world leader in innovation and some of the products coming from this country have been unbelievably successful. Along the way they they have also stolen much of the science from other nations and this has extended to business opportunities and the mineral wealth of other countries. The US is not well regarded for its ethics and is hated in some parts of the world, for good reason.
You talk about companies moving to the US with their businesses. That's easy. Just have a look at their tax system. Company tax is not the lowest but no other personal tax rates are this low anywhere in the world from what I have seen. Our own Rupert Murdoch took his business interests to the US and is now a US citizen. We are all glad to see him gone but wish he would stay out of our politics and let the rest of us elect our government, which he refuses to do.
In Australia almost all of our profitable companies have been sold off. Of those left American companies sit at around 50% on their share registries. All of our highly profitable large banks have American banks and institutions who own more of our banks than we do. Many of our wonderful resources are also American owned. I bought shares in the world's third largest LNG deposit, which was Australian owned, some 2 decades ago and it is now owned by Chevron. This is true of many other companies.
The issue with foreign ownership is the same as wealthy people who are allowed to own everything. Sooner or later citizens become serfs and this is not healthy for any population. There needs to be a balance and this is where the tax system used to work well........those with huge personal incomes paid a greater propertion in tax. This has now disappeared as those with immense wealth are of the opinion that they create jobs so should not have to pay any tax....and the tax system has been structured to accommodate this view. So the rest of us pay their share.
Finally....FREEHOLD FARMING LAND. Freehold means 'gone forever'. Farming land is the food supply for a country. And no amount of rhetoric from lame brain economists is going to convince me that selling a country's food producing land is a good idea. What it is is suicide for a nation and anybody who thinks that selling farming land to the government of a country the size of China is wonderful idea should not be permitted to be in government, ever. Anybody with single digit IQ would understand that China and other third world nations are buying our farming land for one reason and one reason only: to produce food for THEIR country, now and in the future when THEIR POPULATIONS are larger. This is where I draw the line in th esand and say NO and it pains me to read posts where people think its a good idea. Give me strength. Even governments in NZ understand that this is the worst of all policies and prohibit it. Australia alone allows this to happen and those who govern the country have taken it upon themselves to do this as the population are not consulted, ever.
"Gradual change"? Yeah right. Self interest has to be the driving force for any nation. Sadly Australia is governed by idiots who take the cake and not even third world nations are run by such destructive and self interest people who govern as Rome burns and who have no regard for future Australians who will be left to either go hungry or go to war. It makes one want to cry.
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like japan
the large chinese population will start falling soon
but faster due to their 1 child policy
they won't need australian farms for their food
like japan + singapore they'll earn export $ to import the food they need
These are the first contractions of China’s coming demographic crunch: its total fertility rate is already below Russia, leaving it as the lower end of world rankings,
and the UN has projected that, given current trends, its population will sink below 1 billion again by the end of this century.
Starting around 2020 China is going to age faster than any society in the history in the world.
By 2025 the age of meaningful Chinese labour export will be over and the one child policy generation will be ‘precious commodities’ at home.
Eventually, Beijing will need to turn to massive immigration itself or risk grey stagnation.
https://www.opendemocracy.net/od-rus...losing-siberia
and who will migrate to china?
probably chinese sick of the racism they suffer in other countries who will be welcomed home
so they will sell up here and there and move home
once they get a proper democratic gov.
Last edited by eri; 06-09-2014, 01:51 PM.have you defeated them?
your demons
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Originally posted by eri View Postif nz were to ban foreigners owning land here
it would be logical to assume that at some stage in the future foreigners would ban nz'ers from owing their land?
You are spreading disinformation.Last edited by speights boy; 06-09-2014, 03:51 PM.
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Your assupmtion of the large Chinese population "falling off soon" is flawed. The one child policy is failing and population is growing, not falling and I suspect that the reason that Chinese and Indian population is increasing is because having children means that people are cared for in old age as there are no retirement benefits in these countries. But remember that the wealth in China is NOT shared and jobs only provide subsistence wages, so don't expect anything to change any time soon.
The reason Japan is suffering from stagflation is that their population is falling. Probably too few children as the Japanese realise there is more to life than procreation. Not sure though. The lesson which we all need to learn from Japan is that falling population means less demand for everything and NO INFLATION as a result...so the prices of local commodities like houses do not increase. This is the rationale economists use toe keep driving never ending population growth which in turns destroys the very environment we all live in and which at some time has to end anyway.
China needs our land for food production, nothing else. Any argument you mount cannot get around that one. Once owned by the Chinese government no nation will ever get it back. You need to ask Fijians about this as they are also going down the same road. They are selling farming land to the Chinese for the future needs of China. And the Chinese NEVER give land back. EVER.
I wish your view was as simplistic as you make out eri. The problem is that if you are wrong and it will not be possible to undo such immense to a nation by future generations. So how about NZ sells its farming to land to China. Sound like a wonderful idea????Last edited by Guest; 06-09-2014, 06:08 PM.
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Originally posted by eri View Postif nz were to ban foreigners owning land here
it would be logical to assume that at some stage in the future foreigners would ban nz'ers from owing their land?
or
are you suggesting that other countries may target NZ only with such a ban ?
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Originally posted by propertysearch View PostSorry if that is too unpalatable to print. It is not racist. It is just the (inconvemient) facts which some hope will go away.
is that you present no facts
just strongly held beliefs which don't stand up to scrutiny
it's like talking with a 7th day adventist about blood donations
have you defeated them?
your demons
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Originally posted by speights boy View PostAre you suggesting that other counties may ban foreigners from ANY country buying land in reponse to NZ's restrictions;
or
are you suggesting that other countries may target NZ only with such a ban ?
nz'ers don't need a visa to visit japan
because japanese do not need a visa to visit here
australians do/did need a visa to visit japan
because australia requires(ed) japanese tourists to have visas
Some countries do not require a visa in some situations, such as a result of reciprocal treaty arrangements
ever driven overseas on a nz licence?
if you have it's because reciprocality agreements
maybe nz could ban some kinds of foreigners from owning some kinds of land here
in the 80's foreigners couldn't buy land on offshore islands like waiheke
(but they got rid of that because it was too difficult to administer)
but if you want to fully think through what could happen in any situation
it's wise to start from matthew 7,12
"In everything, therefore, treat people the same way you want them to treat you, for this is the Law and the Prophets.Last edited by eri; 06-09-2014, 07:10 PM.have you defeated them?
your demons
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