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  1. #11

    Default Prescient

    Quote Originally Posted by Xav View Post
    The real question is, is foxinthehenhouse psychic and if so how much does it cost to go to one of his seminars??
    Yah <snort>. Prescient, alright.

    We're each fairly to be judged by our track records and the veracity of past statements, in my opinion.
    It's almost enough to make one temper what one says in public, wouldn't you agree?

    Peter Aranyi
    Blog: www.thePaepae.com
    Peter Aranyi
    Blog: www.ThePaepae.com

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    787

    Default

    How many times have we heard that final paragraph?
    Yep, last two paragraphs are good:-

    Critics say information taught at such seminars is easily available at bookstores. “The whole thing is probably a $100 value,” said Ralph Roberts, a real estate investor and the author of the book “Protect Yourself from Real Estate and Mortgage Fraud.”

    Roberts recently attended a foreclosure institute workshop in Detroit and was not impressed. If the content was that good, the institute wouldn't be conducting seminars, he said. “They would be doing it themselves.”

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland City, why invest else where?
    Posts
    984

    Default

    The problem is the article was from Sept 2007.

    If the guy claiming to have bought 3 homes and made $100k equity, then he would have lost his pants by now.

    Housing values in US tanked between 2007 to now.

  4. #14

    Default

    It appears the James chap is one of the salesmen.

    The guru seminar has the founder of National Foreclosure Institute speaking.

    The power of being a guru I guess.

    Make money in real estate foreclosures,”
    read the headline of a full-page ad run in the Star Tribune for several days in late August, 2007. “Learn how easy it can be to tap into the hottest opportunity in real estate!” This invitation seemed right up our alley. I decided to check it out. Howie Gangestad, who has bought foreclosed properties in north Minneapolis, also attended the event.
    The two-hour seminar was held at the Marriott hotel in Bloomington on Sunday, August 26 starting at 3 p.m. Three others were scheduled on consecutive days. Our instructor was a man named James who had lost a job with Montgomery Ward. In 1997 he took the course, sponsored by the National Foreclosure Institute, and moved quickly to put its concepts into practice. A foreclosed property which he bought for $713,000 five years ago had recently been appraised at $1.6 million.


    http://www.landlordpolitics.com/foreclosures.html

  5. #15

    Default Window dressing?

    Quote Originally Posted by speights boy View Post
    The guru seminar has the founder of National Foreclosure Institute speaking.
    Oh, it's an 'institute'.

    Like this one?

    Peter Aranyi
    Blog:www.thePaepae.com
    Peter Aranyi
    Blog: www.ThePaepae.com

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    2,776

    Default Lol

    Couldn't they come up with a better deal??????


    Quote Originally Posted by speights boy View Post
    ......... Our instructor was a man named James.......... A foreclosed property which he bought for $713,000 five years ago had recently been appraised at $1.6 million.



    http://www.landlordpolitics.com/foreclosures.html
    So the property has apparently more than doubled in value over 5 years ... sounds ok on the surface.

    But any decent guru will tell you to by at a 20% discount ...which means the value of the property was (roughly) $891 .... which means the value hasn't quite doubled in 5 years .... a bit less ok especially if you belive the mantra that property will always double every 7 - 10 years which would mean most of the growth in value is natural and has nothing to do with it being a good deal.

    But on the other hand if you believe this.

    In advertising for the event, Eckelman promises that those who attend will "learn how to acquire real estate for only 25% of the value of the property", which Letfus admitted was a direct reference to investing in US tax liens.
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/3929...does-US-u-turn
    Well that would mean a 75% discount (which I would say covers the risk of buying mortgagee/foreclosure property quite well) .....so the value of the property 5 years ago was (again roughly) $2.85 million and now 5 years later it's worth $1.6 mill ........ all of a sudden that deal isn't looking quite so flash as the value has dropped by $1.2 mil or 42%.

    Don't know about you guys but if I was trying to prove my course was value for money I think I would want to provide a better example of a good deal than that.

    Cheers
    spaceman
    Last edited by spaceman; 18-07-2010 at 09:34 AM.
    Delightfully in need of some Tender Loving Care
    Blessed are those who can give without remembering and take without forgetting
    Some things are not as they seem, nor are they otherwise

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    High up above and deep down under
    Posts
    10,915

    Default

    Property guru does US u-turn
    By ROB STOCK - Sunday Star Times Last updated 05:00 18/07/2010
    "They are snake oil, complete with white shoes and wagons :-)"
    That's what self-styled New Zealand property guru Dean Letfus wrote in March last year on Propertytalk.co.nz, when describing the US tax lien investments being promoted by rival Phil Jones.
    Letfus also posted this note: "And if you troll (sic) the various USA web sites they all say only to do it if you are an expert in an area and you can view the property prior. Doing it long distance is specifically warned against again and again."
    Fifteen months on, Letfus is spruiking the very same system.
    Dan Eckelman, the US expert Jones brought over to teach Kiwis about US tax liens and sell them the system used to invest, is one of the gurus presenting later this month at a seminar offered by Letfus's company, NZ Property Gurus Ltd.
    In advertising for the event, Eckelman promises that those who attend will "learn how to acquire real estate for only 25% of the value of the property", which Letfus admitted was a direct reference to investing in US tax liens.
    Letfus told the Sunday Star-Times his position had changed on tax liens. "We looked at it at the time [in March last year] and we couldn't find anybody doing well out of it," he said.
    His earlier opposition had, he said, been partly based on his personal antipathy for Jones, as well as other factors such as exchange rate risk and what he saw as excessive costs.
    But Letfus said his new view was based on a changed exchange rate position, as well as the tax lien education being sold at the seminar being delivered by Steve Goodey in New Zealand rather than out of the US.
    "Because Steve's involved and people are making good money out of it, and the world has a totally different look to it, it is a good opportunity for some people."
    Tax lien certificates are a product of US local authorities. When a household fails to pay local property taxes (the equivalent of our rates), the local authority may recover the debt by auctioning it off to investors. In return for paying the debt, investors buy the right to recover the money and levy penalty interest, sometimes as high as 25%. The tax defaulters are often struggling families hit hard by America's housing and jobs market crashes. The debt is entered as a lien against their homes, and should they not pay, the certificate holder can force the sale of the property.
    In his March 2009 attack on US tax liens, Letfus agreed with other doubters that they were "high risk, money could be tied up for years, no guarantee of profitability, etc" going on to voice his concerns over the potential for hidden costs and investors finding the profits they end up with are "paper only equity, which may equate to zero in real dollars".
    Not all critics from last year have been won over, however.
    David Whitburn, the president of the Auckland Property Investors Association, was concerned about the high risks and costs of the tax lien investment systems being sold to Kiwis for thousands of dollars.
    He lists 14 concerns on his website, including the costs of US accountancy services, difficulties enforcing liens and complying with US and New Zealand tax law. He also notes just how hard it is to buy the liens, which are being sold as a quick way to get rich.
    Whitburn said some investors had told him of their experiences.
    "Eight months later of genuine trying and they told me still no tax liens. Other investors trying every couple of days for three months have not been able to secure any deals either."
    The unwitting, he said, could find themselves accidentally buying a lemon.
    "You could purchase a piece of swampland, a landlocked property, a road, a tiny section with a tree on it, a footpath, etc, if you don't do your due diligence properly."
    Whitburn added: "If it [tax lien investments] were so good, why can't more of the 305 million Americans purchase tax liens, rather than getting 4.3 million New Zealanders to purchase them?"

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/3929...does-US-u-turn
    "There's one way to find out if a man is honest-ask him. If he says 'yes,' you know he is a crook." Groucho Marx

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    274

    Exclamation Why invest in US tax liens and deeds?

    Thanks for posting Rob Stock's article in the Sunday Star Times. Rob is one of New Zealand's leading financial journalists and I was delighted that he also read my blog cautioning investors on US tax liens and deeds.

    I do feel strongly against US tax liens & deeds for fellow New Zealanders, and would submit that the Securities Act should be broadened to require a prospectus and investment statement to give 100% full and final disclosure of the risks and issues surrounding US tax liens and deeds. Whilst I am aware of Kiwis over in the US doing well with US tax liens and deeds, the product is being pitched to Kiwis who have no desire to go over to the US. As Dean Letfus said on 9 March 2009 in the US Tax Liens thread last year at https://www.propertytalk.com/forum/sh...276#post168276

    "I've spoken to people here and in the USA, they are snake oil, complete with white shoes and wagons".
    Well said Dean as I couldn't agree with you any more.

    Therefore I was surprised when I attended NZ Property Gurus in March 2010, that US tax liens and deeds were part of a hard core sales pitch by Steve Goodey (ex Richmastery Wellington franchise owner and the man who picked up the failed Blue Peak property reselling & financing venture), and plugged by Shaun Stenning (MC). I note that next weekend (24th July as the information day, 25th July as the hard core selling day) has US tax lien investing guru Dan Ekelman presenting. This is clearly a major part of the self proclaimed "Gurus" strategy, and if you purchased a $20,000 mentoring course in March's NZ Property Gurus you would get the US$6,000 tax liens and deeds course for "free".

    I note that NZ Property Gurus Limited is a New Zealand registered company (company number 2394550) with Dean Nicholas Letfus as the sole director and shareholder.

    With so many investors feeling the pinch still and next year depreciation claims are being slashed, the search for the next magical silver bullet is there. Promoters with admittedly very slick marketing are taking advantage of Kiwis appetite to earn more money and go into the next new thing. Therefore my advice is that if you decide to go to NZ Property Gurus, good for you as you may potentially learn something that is correct; but please don't take your credit card along. Wait a few days so you can research the product that you may feel you need after being told in a smooth sales presentation that you need it. Then assess whether you actually need it, the pros and cons of it, and ensure that you talk any decision you make over with a few knowledgeable people firstly.

    DISCLAIMER: Note that this blog constitutes my personal and honest opinion of a US tax lien and deed product, and any offence caused to any person promoting these high margin educational products or US tax lien or deed acquisition system is not intended. I am not representing the Board or Membership of the Auckland Property Investors' Association (Incorporated) {"APIA"} with this post, however I have encouraged members not to purchase any educational products or packages on US tax liens and deeds for the reasons set out in Rob Stock's Sunday Star Times article today and my Blog linked in paragraph 1. This post is not intended to be or constitute legal advice, and I would encourage prospective US tax lien or deeds purchasers to speak with a suitably trained US and NZ lawyer, and also a suitably skilled US and NZ tax accountant about the full impact of their decisions prior to incurring any costs in relation to any proposed purchase.
    Last edited by cube; 18-07-2010 at 08:02 PM. Reason: fixed some typos

  9. #19
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Wellington
    Posts
    1,520

    Default

    All nonsense, snake oil salesmen, buyer beware!

    Leftus is a very strange last name, does anyone know which country it comes from? I cannot find anyone in the world with this last name, seems very strange.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    3,936

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Commercial Dan View Post
    All nonsense, snake oil salesmen, buyer beware!

    Leftus is a very strange last name, does anyone know which country it comes from? I cannot find anyone in the world with this last name, seems very strange.
    Very few but there are some in world Czech Republic

    http://lastnames.myheritage.com/last-name/Letfus


 

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