Negative comments about PTers

[One]

I've been very disappointed lately to see so many comments by PTers attacking other PTers, especially but not only competitors.

Whether they're justified or not doesn't seem to me to be the point. They derail threads, piss off valuable long-term members enough that they leave, and make property investors look like idiots to the press, at a time when we can't afford it.

But if they are justified, the info probably needs to get out there.

So I'd like to propose this thread as an alternative.

If you want to make a negative comment about a fellow PTer, how about making it in here, and posting a link to this thread into any related threads.

What does everyone think?

[Stevegoodey]

Good one. A thread complaining about being negative dedicated to being negative.

[Monid]

I don't think your sarcasm is entirely fair Steve - One is complaining not just about negativity but also about this derailling otherwise productive threads and making a helpful suggestion I think.

I'd prefer if people started new threads when they have (valid) concerns to raise - rather than focus them here , but I agree with One they shouldn't derail other threads.

Thanks One, for making a helpful suggestion
Cheers
David

[Stevegoodey]

Yes your totally correct people shouldn't be negative in which case your last post was what?

But I do agree that threads should not be derailed because on other forums when that happens they have moderators who will bring the thread back to topic unfortunatly PT has gone down another route and it's style of moderation is more of a mystery.

[Monid]

Steve - I didn't say people shouldn't be negative - Personally I think there is a place for criticism on PT.

I'm not sure what you find mysterious - the rules are fairly clear: http://www.propertytalk.com/forum/announcement.php?f=55

Cheers
David

[donna]

I think there are are a handful of users here in need of some 'happy' pills - maybe they are getting ready to be candidates for the 'grumpy old men' TV series.

I also say stop chucking your toys at the moderators - they do an outstanding job and there are (as usual) only a handful of 'grumpy candidates' that let rip on here for lack of another channel (my guess).

Remember we are more than a couple of handfuls of people.......around 20,000 come here every month! We have survived other such outbursts and intend to do so again.


How about we get back on topic - as someone I know said recently....focus on issues not personalities.

Cheers,

Donna

[WBuffett]

I think you may be forgetting that the people you are talking about you are slinging mud back and forwards between themselves are hurting, they are hurting financially. The recession has hit them harder than most of us.
And when someone is hurting financially they lash out, its human nature, they are quicker to anger, the stress of it all builds up.
So perhaps instead of jumping on them for being so "negative" have a thought to what they are going through, a bit of compassion goes a long way.

[Taupo Tiger]

Maybe so but they can go somewhere else and do it. They all seem to have their own websites or blogs.

[Mark_B]

....unfortunatly PT has gone down another route and it's style of moderation is more of a mystery.

The PT style of moderation has always been a bit of a mystery to me too, but I think it reflects that PT is run as a business and relies on traffic [see below] to justify the revenue it generates from ads, etc.

...around 20,000 come here every month!

[Xav]

I think the moderators do a good job keeping threads on topic. I use a lot of internet forums and of those PT would have one of the lowest frequencies of threads getting off topic.

"Off topic" and "derailed" may be different things depending on your definition I suppose. The PT approach has always erred on the side of open and free discussion even if it means some mud gets slung. You may disagree with that approach but don't see how it is mysterious. As Monid says the rules are quite clear in that regard.

[Bluekiwi]

I think this negative complaining thread has got off to a fantastic start.

I would like to complain about K1w1, how do I do a link to all comments he has ever made ???

[Wayne]

Maybe so but they can go somewhere else and do it. They all seem to have their own websites or blogs.

There are a number of categories to raise threads in - how about a new one that sepcialises in mud slinging? At least people will know where to go to participate in the games or where to avoid.

[PeterEmpowerEd]

My two cents' worth ...

Donna: fair comment.

I know expressing opinions can lead to things getting fraught and reactive. Even I (?!?) can get a bit precious when I feel my reputation is being besmirched unfairly. But truthfully, some criticism seems perfectly fair, uncomfortable as it might be. Certainly I try to be fair, and provide evidence/sources for my comments rather than unsupported assertions.

Steve: thanks for your comments. It’s not about “negative” in my view. It’s about civility in the PT community.

As I said in 2007:

I think "you're being negative, you're bashing, that's bad" is a criticism that's overused. It's sometimes used as a smokescreen and refuge for the indefensible. It's not about "the negative". Negative things will always, always need to be spoken about. Loudly. In my view it's part of this community's 'soul purpose' to issue the warnings that need to be issued. More strength to you!

In my view the real issue is ugly, insulting behaviour and language, as I've posted elsewhere. Mild insults and put-downs (mea culpa, occasionally, sure. PM or call me if I ever hurt your feelings - seriously) can quickly turn ugly when someone gets stung. If they react badly (names withheld to protect the guilty) the boards can turn septic pretty quick.

Physician heal thyself... I say, "Poster, moderate thyself."

Now, before someone else says it: I'm not saying I always achieve that. (Individual results may vary, as they say on the exercise programmes.)

I like the suggestion of starting a new post to deal with issues rather than de-railing. God knows some threads disappear down the rabbit hole or slide into inane 'wit' competitions.

I try starting threads sometimes. I started one called Thoughts about the rules (Yes, OK, boring title) about some of these very issues.

Have a quick scan if you care. (This was the location of my [in]famous offer to be a Moderator. Not appropriate, apparently. Fair enough. So innocent.)

Mark B: The Mods
I’ve posted in defence of the Mods a number of times, even recently.

We PT ‘members’/forumites are entitled to form and express our own opinions (within the rules) about the outworking of that process and decisions here on the discussion forum... or elsewhere. Naturally. And let me emphasise: the good-hearted, genuine efforts of the Mods here to be 'neutral' and fair-minded mean it's a privilege to be part of the PT community. I mean that, whether I agree with every decision they take or not.

Like Xav, I still think we are very well served, and we have much to be grateful for:

... I see them as similar in spirit to the APIA volunteers: doing their best, overworked and under appreciated,... and often caught in conflict not of their own making. While I don't agree with every decision, overall, I see them as honest people doing a demanding job.

It’s not fair to single anyone out, but I personally appreciate it very much when the Mods choose to be communicative about their decisions — not always possible, I understand that.

Last thought:
Look, no-one likes being criticised. It can really hurt one’s feelings. As I have said elsewhere, I would hate for some of the things I’ve said about certain people’s behaviour to be said about me -- that’s why I don’t do what they do.
(Well, it’s one of the reasons.)


Best wishes - Peter

[Monid]

The official view and way forward can be found here: http://www.propertytalk.com/forum/sh...552#post210552

Thanks
David Hunter
PT Moderator

[Wayne]

Maybe so but they can go somewhere else and do it. They all seem to have their own websites or blogs.

start a new section for mud slingers