Financial Armageddon!!

[donna]

There's probably a huge number of hairdressers in Greece aye!

cheers,

Donna

[Austrokiwi]

There's probably a huge number of hairdressers in Greece aye!

cheers,

Donna

I assume that was said in jest...problem is it won't just be hairdressers who get the danger retirement: Painters, Quarry workers(stone dust), Rubbish collectors, police, prison officers and so on will also be eligible for early retirement due to hazardous working conditions. Bet if someone checked you would find women get their pensions 5 years earlier than men( not uncommon in Europe)

[Perry]

The five year male/female eligibility variation
was indeed quoted in the article, Austro.

[Austrokiwi]

The five year male/female eligibility variation
was indeed quoted in the article, Austro.

Well that makes it obvious I only skim read the article. It is typical of Austria as well. I find it bizarre that although women live longer than men they are allowed to retire ( meaning receive their Gvt pension) 5 years earlier. Also the one earner per family is far more common here with woman remaining at home to raise children and the social systems actively supporting such a life choice.
In Old Europe sexism is much more in evident( in comparison to the "new" world) There are other weird things: People here actually have to pay a church tax.....only if they declare they are of a particular sect( ie: catholic protestant etc), obviously their Church of choice encourages them actively to make such a declaration. Probably that is a hang over from the Holy Roman empire days

[One]

I thought the church tax was a way to cover costs of hellishly expensive historic buildings.

[eri]

ouch

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/property/n...lery_id=123921

[flyernzl]

The basics of the problem, as I see it, is that the Greeks (and a lot of others) have been living above their earnings for many years.
Now that the clock has reached midnight, the time has come when they must reduce their standard of living.

This can be done in two ways:
either: cut all incomes
or: keep the same incomes, but reduce their purchasing power.

The first option is overt and fraught with political danger (as the EEC countries are discovering).
The second option is covert but can only be carried out by a country that has its own currency, which it can devalue.

The Greeks are taking the first option, with the resultant ructions.
New Zealand has taken the second route - we are being paid more, in NZ dollars, but our income is less, in world terms. The process is subtle, gradual, and only causes low-level grumbling.

[Austrokiwi]

Still thinking about this... new way of looking at the situation(re NZ) for me. Are New Zealanders being paid more. Has Nzers purchasing power gone up or down over the last decade? one of the ways I see Greece is different to NZ is that it is the Greek government who has built up the debts and now the people have to suffer to pay off those debts. Where as in New Zealand gvts since 1984 have worked hard to reduce NZs debt while private debt has climbed. In Greece the gvt cut backs lead to the population being upset. In New Zealand each consumer is indebted( of course speaking in general.)...so with no government to blame less complaining.

[flyernzl]

In relative terms, the average standard of living in NZ has fallen over the last few decades.
Although we may live better then we did say 40 years ago (the inflation-adjusted price of clothing and appliances for instance) we have dropped well down the list in comparison with other countries eg Singapore.

The Greek Government debt represents money paid out to individuals - public servants, pensioners, beneficiaries. Those individuals have been overpaid in economic terms, and rather than load that cost on to productive members of their society they borrowed the money.

[cube]

Statiscs new zealand:

Median weekly income in 2001 - $641
Median weekly income in 2011 - $800

RBNZ Inflation calculator - $641 2001 dollars have the purchasing power of $880 2011 dollars.

You're being paid more but can buy less.

[Davo36]

Still thinking about this... new way of looking at the situation(re NZ) for me. Are New Zealanders being paid more. Has Nzers purchasing power gone up or down over the last decade? one of the ways I see Greece is different to NZ is that it is the Greek government who has built up the debts and now the people have to suffer to pay off those debts. Where as in New Zealand gvts since 1984 have worked hard to reduce NZs debt while private debt has climbed. In Greece the gvt cut backs lead to the population being upset. In New Zealand each consumer is indebted( of course speaking in general.)...so with no government to blame less complaining.

You're bang on the money there I reckon Austro.

In Greece there were all sorts of rorts going on at the top levels.

Goldman Sachs were even paid huge fees to hide their government indebtedness from the rest of the EU (all documented).

And now the people are saddled with the debts.

While the guilty have bazillions tucked away in various places...

[eri]

like italy

1 of the big "takers" in greece

has been the church

in nz

we worship at the altar of the individual

demanding the gov. tax others

to pay for our "needs"

too much entitlement

all round

[Davo36]

Yeah we should all be accountable, stand on our own 2 feet etc. But no one likes that message.

So we vote in governments that will give us stuff.

[flyernzl]

Statiscs new zealand:


You're being paid more but can buy less.

My point precisely.
Inflation and currency devaluation are the covert ways of sorting out the problem.

Of course in doing so the politically unimportant people (the thrifty, the productive) get screwed while those with political clout (the speculators, the borrowers) get advantaged, but that's life.

[Austrokiwi]

My point precisely.
Inflation and currency devaluation are the covert ways of sorting out the problem.

Of course in doing so the politically unimportant people (the thrifty, the productive) get screwed while those with political clout (the speculators, the borrowers) get advantaged, but that's life.

OK I get what your saying now......but I have a slightly different way of understanding it. My perception is NZers aren't being paid more rather their being paid less, how ever the differences in the way we put things are moot as we both see the same thing just describe it slightly differently. As I see it there is an unconscious institutionalized rort going on in New Zealand: with out going into full detail I tell you the solution ( the problem is easily understood then) I think The taxation rules should be changed so that tax on interest is adjusted by the CPI.....ie: if the inflation rate is 3% and the interest received in a tax year is 5%. The only part of the interest accrued taxed is the 2% difference. I think it would be a nice feedback control on Gvt mismanagement of the economy.