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Greens Wealth Tax?

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  • Anthonyacat
    replied
    Originally posted by Perry View Post
    Anyone want to stab a guess at how many houses there are in Auckland valued at $1M or more?
    According to a quick Google, there are 540,000 homes in Auckland. Our median home price is something north of $900,000 and tipped by some commentators to reach $1M by the end of the year, particularly if we get a post-election boom. Usually a pending election slows down the market, but it didn't seem to this time. Or did it, and the frenzy we have seen was actually slow?

    In any case, with 540,000 houses and a median price approaching $1M, the answer to your question is somewhere near 270,000.

    But you can't forget liability offset aspects. The vast majority of those homes have mortgages on them to some extent. Anything bought in the last 5-10 years the debt will be quite substantial.

    You also can't forget that most homes aren't owned by one person, it's usually a couple. So the home would need to be $2M+ for that alone to trigger the wealth tax. While we're certainly seeing a few of those now, it'll be at least a couple election cycles before we see it as the norm.

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  • Perry
    replied
    Anyone want to stab a guess at how many houses there are in Auckland valued at $1M or more?

    (Forget the beach bach, fancy car, boat and liability offset aspects, for the moment.)

    I wonder how many farms in NZ would be valued under $1M? Or were farms supposed to be exempt?

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSky
    replied
    Originally posted by PC View Post
    More tax and tenants "rights" we go.
    Sir Robert is absolutely right about never owning residential rentals!!
    I hear Australia's nice.
    100%
    If it weren't for the taxes I would be buying over there

    Ak market is too overcooked , previously unrenovated houses were selling with reno price built in! (endors wanting to sell WITHOUT actually doing any work!
    now any property with lit bit of land are selling as potential to subdivide lol $1M in Manuewa
    certainly Not for the faint hearted

    Leave a comment:


  • Sanya
    replied
    Originally posted by Perry View Post
    [...]

    Of course, with redundant partners in gummint, then Comrade Cindy can blame them for what goes wrong.

    Good observation Perry.

    Yes, if she choses to Govern alone and still fails in important areas like housing (backlog for state housing has dramatically increased) and child poverty (no change in the number of children living in material hardship) - she will no longer be able to fall back on being a "war-time Prime Minister" feeding the masses at the next election or be able to pass blame to partners.

    In short, COVID-19 is not going to indefinitely inoculate her against underperformance in weighty social and economic issues.
    Last edited by Sanya; 18-10-2020, 03:17 PM.

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  • Perry
    replied
    Originally posted by Sanya View Post
    Will Jacinda include the Greens and perhaps even lone Māori Party MP Rawiri Waititi in her new government, either in Cabinet or in a confidence and supply agreement? She has spoken of her desire for consensus-building - so perhaps.
    Sounds good until one asks consensus-building with whom?

    Of course, with redundant partners in gummint, then Comrade Cindy can blame them for what goes wrong.

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  • Sanya
    replied
    Originally posted by donna View Post
    Well it may not have been the outcome we all wished for but it's Goodbye to the Greens Weath Tax - yaaaaooh!

    cheers,

    Donna

    Hope you are right Donna.

    Will Jacinda include the Greens and perhaps even lone Māori Party MP Rawiri Waititi in her new government, either in Cabinet or in a confidence and supply agreement? She has spoken of her desire for consensus-building - so perhaps.

    Leave a comment:


  • Frezzinghot
    replied
    Originally posted by PC View Post
    More tax and tenants "rights" we go.
    Sir Robert is absolutely right about never owning residential rentals!!
    I hear Australia's nice.
    So what is the alternative? Mass exodus of mum and dad investors, homes flood the market, first home buyers take up the slack,(those that can be bothered} BUT cause and would be huge slump in prices?

    The puppeteers would not like that, huge losses for residential banks.

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  • PC
    replied
    More tax and tenants "rights" we go.
    Sir Robert is absolutely right about never owning residential rentals!!
    I hear Australia's nice.

    Leave a comment:


  • Perry
    replied
    I do hope you're right, Donna.

    Don't overlook comrade socialist Cindy's undertaking to bring some Watermelons into parliament. Just what form that would take and how much influence the Watermelons would have is the concern.

    I hope ACT do better than Winston First ever did. Not sorry to see that slippery fellow slip away.
    Last edited by Perry; 18-10-2020, 09:18 AM.

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  • donna
    replied
    Well it may not have been the outcome we all wished for but it's Goodbye to the Greens Weath Tax - yaaaaooh!

    cheers,

    Donna

    Leave a comment:


  • Jeffa
    replied
    I doubt any "substantial" new taxes will be introduced in the next term of government.
    The recession and resulting increasing unemployment will will be the determining factor in any left leaning or democratic politicians here or USA to raise taxes.
    There number one primary goal will be to reduce unemployment ,increasing taxes on businesses or individuals will cause the opposite effect.
    The next government will introduce more stimulus into the economy so makes little sense to take it back in taxes because you will arrive at square 1 with higher unemployment.

    In 3 or 4 years when the country is back to "full time " employment and not "part time " like we are at now and asset prices have increased 50% that is when you may see new taxes.
    I suppose it is whoever wants to get elected and how wealthy the center voter is or isn't.

    Interestingly the Labour government in England 40 or 50 years ago * introduced a death tax on the wealthy aristocrat landlords of 80% .
    The next generation could not afford to maintain mansions and castles so had to tear them down, oddly enough the same Labour government set up trust with taxpayer funded money to protect and restore the few remaining mansions as apart of saving English history.
    Last edited by Jeffa; 16-10-2020, 06:57 PM.

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  • Sanya
    replied
    On the 15th of October, Green party co-leader James Shaw has once again said that its "not credible for Labour to rule out wealth tax discussions." [1]

    While it is not outside
    realm of possibility that Labour could govern alone, current polls indicate Labour will need the Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand for support to form Government and the Labour party will have to relent in order to obtain an parliament majority - assuming the Green's hit the 5% threshold. Labour will happily blame the Greens for "forcing them" to introduce the new tax which is expected to impact Auckland (in particular) where the average house price is projected to be $3 million by 2040. [2]

    I wonder how many voters look at the wealth tax today and say they are not impacted - without considering how debt reduction and house price increases over time will?


    Source: [1] https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political...-credible-shaw
    [2] https://www.oneroof.co.nz/news/avera...-by-2040-37028
    Last edited by Sanya; 16-10-2020, 05:53 PM.

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  • BigBrianB
    replied
    Am I correct in saying the Wealth Tax will be close to 30% of rent income?
    If AK average rent is 650 pw. (33800 PA) and Average house price is just under 1 million. The wealth tax at 1% or 2% of a home is 10 to 20000 or around 30 to almost 60% of the rental income. This assumes your already over the 1 million or 2 million net wealth threshold with no loans on the house. This seams very oppressive? Or am I wrong?

    Leave a comment:


  • Sanya
    replied
    Originally posted by Anthonyacat View Post
    [...]

    This is without even mentioning the massive administrative overhead to keep this thing running.

    Yes, assets have to be valued annually for an annual net wealth tax. This would create compliance costs and complexity in a tax system which is largely lauded for its simplicity.

    Complexity would quickly create a tax riddled with exemptions and it is such exemptions that have rendered wealth taxes ineffective in other countries.

    Leave a comment:


  • Perry
    replied
    Originally posted by Anthonyacat View Post
    Got to argue with you there I'm afraid Perry! This is much much worse than a CGT.
    Agreed. I was too glib. Sorry. It's a Draconian variant.

    It allows comrade socialist Cindy to say, "I've kept my word, it's not a CGT," even though it's that and so much more.

    When / if things go bad, she can blame the watermelon party.

    Any CGT that did not factor in inflation would also be a gain that was "imaginary [and] unrealised."
    Last edited by Perry; 12-10-2020, 06:52 PM.

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