How are HNZ tenants assessed?

[td91]

I've just had HNZ tenants move into a property next door to my place and being off working from home all week. I've noticed them moving in, they've got flatscreen tvs (bigger than mine) a nice leather lounge suite, bedroom suites all matching, a big double fridge all the nice mod cons and to top it all off a pretty recent model car too. My question is, how on earth are tenants with such nice things moving into HNZ houses? my understanding was that if you were granted HNZ accommodation you were pretty desperate for a house and couldn't afford a normal rental property.

Just a bit confused as a tax payer how they can afford all these nice things, yet can't pay for the market rent for a normal house? Is there a way these types con the system or something? I just don't think it's right seeing people moving into a house they are probably paying a pittance for and bringing in a whole lot of nice things with them.

[dd1d2]

Interesting topic! A friend overheard a couple of ladies outside a laundromat, that life sucked because WINZ only approved $1000 for their new TV and they had to borrow the rest from Instance Finance. Guess who is going to be paying off that loan? I would like to know how they are getting away with this!

I've just had HNZ tenants move into a property next door to my place and being off working from home all week. I've noticed them moving in, they've got flatscreen tvs (bigger than mine) a nice leather lounge suite, bedroom suites all matching, a big double fridge all the nice mod cons and to top it all off a pretty recent model car too. My question is, how on earth are tenants with such nice things moving into HNZ houses? my understanding was that if you were granted HNZ accommodation you were pretty desperate for a house and couldn't afford a normal rental property.

Just a bit confused as a tax payer how they can afford all these nice things, yet can't pay for the market rent for a normal house? Is there a way these types con the system or something? I just don't think it's right seeing people moving into a house they are probably paying a pittance for and bringing in a whole lot of nice things with them.

[PTILoveYou]

Well there are few possibilities:
1) they could be working a part time job, while not declaring that income to WINZ & HNZ
2) they could be working a part time job as a thief (a policeman told me a lot of thieves are on the dole)
3) they can't save too much money in the bank, or they won't get more benefit, so they have to spend it

[Eugene]

This is a fairly old problem.
According to the bible Jesus said, 'the poor you will always have with you' and in some accounts added 'and whenever you want, you can do good for them'.

Modern social and economic thinking would have us leave the poor with the freedom (and dignity) to make choices about how to spend their benefits even if the choices they make are bad ones.
And even though the consequences of these bad choices fall on society (again).

Government is making available more and more free early childhood education, education is supposed to break the cycle of poverty.
And free doctor visits for children might help too - bad health early in life is hugely detrimental, the effects only worsen throughout the person's life.

But yeah it sucks that beneficiaries can spend/do spend on all this stuff, we certainly don't.

At least there are fewer beneficiaries now:

http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/pb/business/qoa/50HansQ_20140417_00000006/6-beneficiaries%E2%80%94statistics

At the end of the March quarter there were 295,320 people on a benefit.
This is 15,000 fewer people than at the same time last year. During the
recession the number of people on a benefit peaked at 352,707, in
December 2010. There are nearly 60,000 fewer people on the benefit
today.

[Debs]

If you sincerely wanted to know the eligibilty criteria for HNZ tenants, I'm sure you could look into it. It seems more like a great time to make some stereotypical judgements 'as a taxpayer' becaause you're 'confused' apparently. You don't know how they accumulated these items and you may never know..so really it's all conjecture and a nice chance for us all to jump in here and slate them. I can think of several other legitimate reasons but oh no - they must be thieves and vagabonds...

[td91]

So WINZ granted them $1000 for a tv, and then they get the rest from Instant Finance? WINZ may as well of just loaned them the whole lot, they're pretty much paying for it anyway. Why is the taxpayer paying for beneficiaries to have $1000 tv's surely an old box style tv, and a freeview receiver would suffice? I'm not bashing beneficiaries or anything, but a benefit is there as a temporary measure while you raise a kid in the first 12-24 months, or while you search for job not to supply a luxurious lifestyle. If people are on a benefit for reasons beyond their own control ie: disabled fine a tv but not for those on a benefit for a short term.

Yeah I'd say it's one of those Gary, but I bet when they have their HNZ inspected, the property manager doesn't question for one second why they have nice things and are living in HNZ housing.

Very true Eugene. I don't have half the things they've got, yes, I could afford it if I didn't put almost half my wage into property a week. But I work for my money, so that's a choice completely made up to me. Beneficiaries are supposed to be given enough to pay rent, power, water, food and transport. Maybe they're getting too much?

[artemis]

The family may have fallen on hard times after buying all the stuff. Or they might be heavily in debt. In either of those cases, they might well have been evicted for private sector rent arrears and been living in overcrowded conditions with family or friends.

It's been quite a while since I worked in the allocation of state houses in Auckland. But the current process is probably similar. It was a detailed points system based mainly on current living conditions, financials and health. In those days families were more likely to get a state house if they had all of those factors. Overcrowding is cited as a health issue by the child poverty groups, but as I recall the main issues were stress and consequent strife. Not uncommon for this to result in family out on the street again.

[Maccachic]

artemis you missed the jump the queue if you go running to the media.

[PTWhatAGreatForum]

I've just had HNZ tenants move into a property next door to my place and being off working from home all week. I've noticed them moving in, they've got flatscreen tvs (bigger than mine) a nice leather lounge suite, bedroom suites all matching, a big double fridge all the nice mod cons and to top it all off a pretty recent model car too. My question is, how on earth are tenants with such nice things moving into HNZ houses?

How about minding your own business? They make their choices and you make yours. How would you like being put under a microscope? Are you sure you deserve everything you have?

Maybe they bought these items in better times. I suggest you watch what you say in case it comes back to bite you in the butt. Good fortune and health can't be taken for granted and one day you might be the one who has their hand out. Ask yourself - if you were in this situation, how would you feel about being reduced to a pauper to satisfy a nosy NIMBY neighbor?

Or they might be heavily in debt.

Like many of the people present here?

2) they could be working a part time job as a thief (a policeman told me a lot of thieves are on the dole)

By your own measure of personal success (you constantly tell us about how much paper money you have made in the present "any fool can make money" Auckland market), you are an even bigger financial success and therefore, also a bigger crook, when your own standards are turned back to you.

[Davo36]

I think they should be assessed on their mental health. Based on this, MichaelNZ has been overdue for a state funded house for some time.

[Eugene]

I agree with Michael.
What do residential housing investors do to make the world a better place? Nothing

[eri]

they do the same as

people who invest in food production and sales

the same as people who produce and sell clothing, shoes, textbooks etc

which is more important that people who make and sell cars, novels, art or coffee

do you live in a house you or your parents built?

if not, why not?

did you dig the sewer?

put in the power?

build the furniture?

weave the carpet?

you probably didn't even paint all the walls or hang the paper

[PTWhatAGreatForum]

they do the same as

people who invest in food production and sales

the same as people who produce and sell clothing, shoes, textbooks etc

which is more important that people who make and sell cars, novels, art or coffee

do you live in a house you or your parents built?

No they don't. By the account of some present here they do very little. To quote one poster - who is bragging he turned $200k (and a gift at that) into a $5-million paper portfolio, one has to wonder how much effort and commercial acumen it takes in the present Auckland market.

To start a business - especially one from scratch - requires a lot of hard work, risk and multi skills in marketing, management, client relations, product development, accounting, sales and then some... On top of that little is gauranteed (It's risky) and no bank wants to know.

When you eventually make a profit, the taxman has their hand out because you can't chalk it up to capital gains...

It's too easy and stupid to make money in Auckland right now. But, like all bubbles, it will go pop. Then many of the "I'm all right Jack, keep your hands off my stack" petty-capitalists will have their hands out at the local WINZ office.

PS: It's happened before!

[eri]

most of the left, blame all the right

for the sins of their worst example

most of the right, blame all the left

for the sins of their worst example

try to keep yourself up to date, informed

and practice a little more discrimination

(start by looking that word up

if it upsets you)

[NomoneyNotalk]

Hi Td,

I have asked someone who was living in a housing nz house about the procedures. He first applied and HNZ wanted to see his bank account, and then he chose the area he wish to live in and he was put on a waiting list. When a house became available he was then asked if he would like to live there, if not then continue to wait until another house became available. Finally after a few months ,a brand new house in Henderson was available and he moved in there with his wife.

Problem is HNZ only checked one of his bank account, and people have multiple accounts in different banks. So by showing the account with the least amount of money would make him look like he needed help and qualify for a free house.

And brand new house is a bit too much and unfair in my opinion, as many other people are still renting old houses