Stocks & shares buying & selling.Looking at starting up & learning.

[BlueSky]

Properties and shares are entirely 2 different asset classes although if you buy property syndicates then its a different story.

Best to read and do lots of research not disimiler to when you buy properties.

before you invest ask
1. Does the company sell anything? Laugh all you want, but this one question (and its answer) can save you lots and lots of money...and grief. If you look at most biotech companies, they don't sell anything except hope. They have no revenues, but their stories are fantastic. Investors can get carried away with the promise (not the revenues or profits) of these sometime miracle producers. Most often, the promise turns to pffffft; the stock goes to zero. If a company doesn't have revenues, it doesn't mean you don't buy it (though you should have very good reasons), it only means you buy very little of it....if you must, and you can't help yourself, and you've temporarily lost your investing compass.

2. Does it make a profit? When you know that a stock price is theoretically the present value of all future profits, it really hits home that profits are essential to a stock's (and your portfolio's) well-being. No stock can continue higher if there are no profits, no matter how promising the premise. Without profits, a company can't grow. Investors like to see increasing profits, no matter the economic conditions.

Everything else is speculation - just ask the 87 crash folks and GFC shares and properties included. If you are after yields then buy co that have give you good yields any capital gains is a bonus -(sounds very similar to property investment doesnt it - perhapes you are in the right place!)
Diversity in asset classes is the key.

[DazRaz]

If you aren't going to put the work in to understand the companies you are investing in then you should use a fund manager. If investing directly in shares isn't more work than property investing then you are just taking a gamble. My first share investment tripled my money in 9 months. Several months later the company was bust. One year later we had the '87 crash. While I didn't have any shares when the crash hit, my gain in '86 and avoiding the crash in '87 was just dumb luck. After learning more since, there were warning signs that the company I invested was going to get in trouble.

Now I use funds because I can't put the amount of time into analysis which is required to invest directly. I borrow in invest in property. When I have cash to invest I use a fund. Since I have a revolving credit account for my investment properties, I am more likely to sink excess cash in there. All said and done, property by far has be better to me.

[Wayne]

Wayne, I guess what happened is this?

With the GFC, the shares went down a fair bit, and then there was a big catchup, and so people in the market made very good gains. Is this right?

Similar to property I guess, if you bought after 2008, you've seen a big 'return to normality'.

But I guess the question might be, where to go from here? Now that both shares and property seem to be at peak prices again, what is one to do?

Not quite right. 7 years takes you back pre GFC as the staring point. In between they dropped ~25% so would have been much better gains if looked over a shorter period.

Peak prices - one peak is just a trough when you look at it a few years later.

[Wayne]

While I didn't have any shares when the crash hit, my gain in '86 and avoiding the crash in '87 was just dumb luck. After learning more since, there were warning signs that the company I invested was going to get in trouble.

Good you recognise that it was luck - many think they are the next Buffett and get themselves into trouble.

[skid]

Properties and shares are entirely 2 different asset classes although if you buy property syndicates then its a different story.

Best to read and do lots of research not disimiler to when you buy properties.

before you invest ask
1. Does the company sell anything? Laugh all you want, but this one question (and its answer) can save you lots and lots of money...and grief. If you look at most biotech companies, they don't sell anything except hope. They have no revenues, but their stories are fantastic. Investors can get carried away with the promise (not the revenues or profits) of these sometime miracle producers. Most often, the promise turns to pffffft; the stock goes to zero. If a company doesn't have revenues, it doesn't mean you don't buy it (though you should have very good reasons), it only means you buy very little of it....if you must, and you can't help yourself, and you've temporarily lost your investing compass.

2. Does it make a profit? When you know that a stock price is theoretically the present value of all future profits, it really hits home that profits are essential to a stock's (and your portfolio's) well-being. No stock can continue higher if there are no profits, no matter how promising the premise. Without profits, a company can't grow. Investors like to see increasing profits, no matter the economic conditions.

Everything else is speculation - just ask the 87 crash folks and GFC shares and properties included. If you are after yields then buy co that have give you good yields any capital gains is a bonus -(sounds very similar to property investment doesnt it - perhapes you are in the right place!)
Diversity in asset classes is the key.

In many ways thats true,but the real money is made investing in a company that has great potential for future profits.
This has happened with pacific edge tech.(PEB) They are now getting very close to profit. In the last 3 weeks its gone from 50c to $1.50 and back to $1.30--by the time the cat is out of the bag you may well have missed the boat and of course for every PEB there are lots who do tank.
I have a friend who has a different strategy.--After years of research he has adopted an approach of buying share in large companies that pay good dividends.--He then hedges against a fall in share price which means he is always even and then just collects the dividends.--If his charts tell him there is a very small percentage chance the share will fall he cuts his hedge to maybe 50% and collects the profit (hopefully)
If this all sounds rather confusing ,it is a good indicator of how much there is to learn.
My approach is much more simple --When the Kiwi$ get really high (85c or higher to the $US) i buy $US through a forex co.
The Kiwi is considered a more risky currency so when something bad happens like possible Greek default,people sell $Kiwi and go to more ''safe'' currencys like the $US and the $Kiwi falls--Thats the time to buy back into $Kiwi with the $US
Of course you can get burned with this approach as well.--Downside is that if $K keeps rising or $US falls(obviously)and the fact that you are not getting interest on $US-----theres always a gamble--I only use money I have.
The idea of revaluing your home (borrowing money)to buy shares is a dangerous game IMO.
The economy could still tank and then you are sitting on debt-not good.

[Toasty]

http://www.sharetrader.co.nz/forumdisplay.php?5-NZX

This forum is a good way to have some discussions and see analysis to support decisions people have made about which companies they will invest in. My strike rate has gone way up since I started following the threads. As always, it comes down to your decisions based on the knowledge that you accumulate.

[artemis]

http://www.sharetrader.co.nz/forumdisplay.php?5-NZX This forum is a good way to have some discussions and see analysis to support decisions people have made about which companies they will invest in. My strike rate has gone way up since I started following the threads. As always, it comes down to your decisions based on the knowledge that you accumulate.

I agree, with the proviso that there can be a fair bit of ramping there, especially on riskier plays. Mostly from enthusiasts with varying levels of expertise rather than pump and dump toerags. My own general approach is to buy reasonably safe bets with growth prospects (eg FBU, SUM) and keep aside money I can afford to lose for some play money. Mixed results on the play side, but early buys on a couple of high flyers more than make up for that.

[Neongreen]

I generally take a more hands off approach and invest in Tyndall's relatively low cost managed funds. They have a range of funds for different asset classes(Corporate bonds, NZ equity, Australasian growth, etc). You can invest directly in $5k lots or through RaboDirect for an additional 0.75% entrance fee in $250+ lots. I like them and have had reasonable success with them. They aren't meant to be traded, but I prefer the buy and hold approach to my investments.

Website: http://www.tyndall.co.nz/
YMMV; I highly recommend seeking advice from a professional, this isn't professional advice and I am not a certified financial advisor blah blah.

[DaveW]

I would be interested to hear which online forex trading platforms people are using.

[Tan]

My take on shares - I was lucky enough to invest in Australian shares - through a friend who was a broker who chose them for me. After the GFC I made enough money to put into my property which desperately needed it! Sorry, no advice there, it was really like a small lotto win I wouldn't expect to repeat.
I understand a lot of big wigs who make money then invest it into real estate to keep it safe.

To invest in shares it helps a lot to have enough accounting skills to read and understand a profit & loss and balance sheet and be able to read between the lines as to what they are/are not saying. Also, it helps to know who is running the company and what their track record is. I am far too lazy to do all the research required, but (and this is a compliment) from what I have seen in your posts, you seem to be a high action person and may love it.

I found a mentor years ago to teach me about the share market and they gave their time for free as many property people will. They taught me the basics but my brain was stuck in property. It was good info and I am glad I now have a basic understanding.

I can handle the accounts and knowing who's who, but keeping an eye on the world was the deal breaker for me

[skid]

I would be interested to hear which online forex trading platforms people are using.

I use NZFOREX

[DaveW]

I use NZFOREX

I checked their website. Do you use them for trading? Their graphs are only showing a minimum one hour timeframes.

[skid]

You should be able to see longer time frames on the graph(I think options are at the bottom)
Im not a major trader,just once in a while when the $Kiwi gets high.
Ive noticed that when the next ''scare'' comes it drops as its considered a more risky currency.
(dont take my word as gospel though)

[Davo36]

Tech stocks taking a battering around the world, again. Does anyone remember 'Weekend at Bernies' selling the house and putting the money into Xero column? I can't find it but did find this: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=11135419 where he waxes lyrical about this 'fantastic' company.

Well it's just gone down 37 percent apparently: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=11238188

[Wayne]

so it's a bargin now - like at a sale price?