unprofessional lawyer and disputable fee

[onno]

Hi is anyone can help me if i donot satisfactory the lawyer's service, any way I can reduce or not pay him. Feb 12 I used him to settle my property, and paid him the full chargeable fee. Later on I found he never gave me invoice and lawyer's settlement statement. I contacted him couple times but still he has not sent it to me. Oct 12 I signed an unditional contract and used him again, later on I decided to pull out the contract, at that time he was unhelpful and very difficult to get hold of, so right before the last day of settlement day, I told him I changed lawyer and informed him transferred all paper work. Jan 13 I received his email with an invoice for the fee incurred in oct 12. I m willing to pay if he showed his professionalism but he did not.any one can help with or let me know what should I do

[Rosco]

Hi onno,

First thing I would try to do is understand the otherside. So on October 12, did the lawyer review the contract for you and charge a reasonable fee (I'm thinking 100-200, but would depend on the work required). If so, from the lawyers point of view, this would be a fair charge for the time incurred.

Once you understand their perspective, then you communicate with them about your unhappiness and the offer you are willing to make. If you are willing to be reasonable, and they are reasonable, then generally you can work something out simply and easily. ie if they charged $200, you might state your issues and offer to pay $100. Generally they would take this and move on. Plus better for you to do the same!

If you can't get anywhere, then I'm pretty sure the law society has a fee resolution service.

Ross

[jimO]

loooooong time ago we used a lawyer to organise a 2nd mortgage (at 22%) he had the bank pay the money into his account and wanted to hang on to it until we were finished the project, i eventually got it off him but he deducted his fee from the amount, same lawyer was prosecuted for stealing a valuable painting from a old lady, im not sure why we needed to go through the lawyer now but it may have been what you had to do back then, early 80s

[gavinc]

<Oct 12 I signed an unditional contract and used him again, later on I decided to pull out the contract,>
So how did you manage to "pull out of the contract"?

[onno]

Thanks all specially resco for your kind and experienced advice. Back oct 12 he did not charge me at all. and he was on behalf of me to deal with vemdor's lawyer by writing two mails a couple days before the settlement. The letters are really short and unprofessional. And I had called him many times until he finally issued a letter to vendor's lawyer. currently he is asking 860. Do you think it is reasonable

[Rosco]

You can ask for the time and cost records that make up the $860.

It sounds a lot from what you have written, but make sure you review the records so that you can understand what time they have spent and on what.

Ross

[Winston001]

loooooong time ago we used a lawyer to organise a 2nd mortgage (at 22%) he had the bank pay the money into his account and wanted to hang on to it until we were finished the project, i eventually got it off him but he deducted his fee from the amount, same lawyer was prosecuted for stealing a valuable painting from a old lady, im not sure why we needed to go through the lawyer now but it may have been what you had to do back then, early 80s

Yes, I remember that. A Frances Hodgkins painting. The lawyer was T B?

As for the mortgage, the bank would have advanced the funds for the lawyer to pay the bills as they came due. It was common in those days for 2nd and 3rd mortgages for home improvements but the money could only be paid out on invoices. That was to prevent home owners spending the money in other directions then leaving builders hanging in the wind.

When that happened, the builder could claim a lien against the title causing all sorts of problems for mortgagees. A risk best avoided if at all possible.

[Ivan McIntosh]

Hi is anyone can help me if i donot satisfactory the lawyer's service, any way I can reduce or not pay him. Feb 12 I used him to settle my property, and paid him the full chargeable fee. Later on I found he never gave me invoice and lawyer's settlement statement. I contacted him couple times but still he has not sent it to me. Oct 12 I signed an unditional contract and used him again, later on I decided to pull out the contract, at that time he was unhelpful and very difficult to get hold of, so right before the last day of settlement day, I told him I changed lawyer and informed him transferred all paper work. Jan 13 I received his email with an invoice for the fee incurred in oct 12. I m willing to pay if he showed his professionalism but he did not.any one can help with or let me know what should I do

The NZLS has, unfortuntately, changed the fee resolution service for the worse, in my opinion. Firstly, it can only be applied for in relation to amounts over $2,000, and I doubt your fee reached that level.

Secondly, the complaint can only be upheld if the lawyer has gone so far as to be worthy of censure fo conduct unbecoming a professsional...a higher standard than the old cost revision service where if the cost revisers felt the fee was a bit over the top they could nudge it down.

Nowadays if the panel feels a bill is a bit high, but not offensively so, and would like to nudge it down a bit, they're stymied because they would have to uphold a professional charge against the lawyer that requires a higher standard of wrongdoing.

Hence there is now encouragement of "early resolution"...getting the two parties talking to each other, to see if they can sort things out.

In your case, the lawyer should have provided statement and invoice. You could lodge a complaint for that. The failure to provide those documents might lead to the lawyer recompensing you as part of early resolution negotiations with you in preference to risking a complaint with the NZLS being upheld for failing to provide the statements.

With regard to October, you should ask for the time records. I suspect that the lawyer, espcially given that settlement was the next day, has done a lot more than you are aware of or giving them credit for.

What were your grounds for pulling out of an unconditional contract, may I ask?

[klauster]

True lawyers are not always right!
Yes a lawyer might cause sometimes problems if they don’t follow client’s instruction.
The question is what instruction have you given him?
If that is clear you can ask for a detailed invoice.
I successfully got money back at the Disputes Tribunal from a lawyer who invoiced me wrongly.

[TheLiberalLeft]

If he never gave you an invoice, how did you know the amount to pay? Never mind why you paid at all until the invoice arrived - that's another question.

[Maccachic]

Is this a New Zealand lawyer?

[onno]

For the first property I purchased from him in Feb 12 no lawyer's settlement statement. I have been asked for twice and txted him once, in April and Sep, but until now still no any response.

For this one unconditonalled in Oct 12 (didnot settle at the end), he gave me an invoice this time (31st Jan 13) which shows

"our fee 899 GST included".

I just feel so unjustic for the service he provied and he charged this without helping me...I feel so unhappy.

[onno]

yup, he is a kiwi lawyer.

[jimO]

Yes, I remember that. A Frances Hodgkins painting. The lawyer was T B?

yes his brother got in hot water some time later for selling stolen property through his auction house