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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    4,760

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Dog View Post
    Hi People,

    I assume we are talking about dehumidifiers here, although it's all a bit cryptic. I have seen stand alone units (in fact had one stolen by a tenant), but I guess you are talking about ceiling mounted babies.

    Does anyone have a web site for healthair? Google is not useful in this case.

    The Dog
    The systems have a de-humidifying effect, but replacing the damp air in the house with drier air from the roof space or outside.

    A stand-alone dehumidifier cools the air that it takes in to condense out the water vapour and then re-heats it to put it back in the room (I think that's how they work!).

    HRV, DVS, Healthaire are basically the same, Moisture Master is the same again but comes with the heater as standard, Cleanaire is a 'heat exchange' system that extracts the heat from air from the home, and uses it to heat 'fresh' air from the outside (not the roof space).

    cube
    DFTBA

  2. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SAllan View Post
    Dog,
    Looks like you missed the e off the end of Healthaire!
    http://www.healthaire.co.nz/
    cheers
    Stu
    Thanks Stu.

  3. #13

    Default HRV is it

    Finally went with HRV because
    a. Outlets in every room and we keep our doors closed at night
    b. Better filter and the wife wanted this for her allergies...
    c. Got a better deal after some negotiations... which I promised not to disclose

    From my experiences of 1 week (house in auckland)
    1. Zero moisture on the windows.... yep none at all
    2. The Air is drier and smells fresher (so says my wife and if she is happy I'm happy)

    But
    3. The claim about free warmth... hmm only during the day is the temperature in the roof warmer than the house.. at night it is at least 2-3 c lower

    Anyways my learnings then

    Moisture Master - Just was not convincing enough about that small fan heater ... don't want a fan heater running all day long.

    HRV - Good for ventilation and filter but expensive because the more rooms you have the more outlets and motors you require.. good for your own home where you might have expensive camera equipment etc that you want dry as can be

    DVS - best value but if you close your doors at night I cannot see it work

    and finally there is no such thing as free heat from the roof

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hamilton New Zealand
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Hi Rockran,
    Interested to hear your comments on HRV. Had a potential option client install an HRV system after their ancient diesel central heating system died. They are very happy with the lack of condensation and the dry air BUT the HRV system does not provide enough heat to keep them warm and they are having to resort to using lots of plug in electric heaters. They have even resurrected the old open fire in the lounge. I recommended that they look into getting a heat pump installed, which would keep them warm and also reduce their skyrocketing heating bill. Therefore be careful when looking at HRV, DVS or systems like these as they tend to need an additional heating source.

    Cheers
    Kevin

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    3,286

    Default

    Hello rockran,

    Yes, I too was interested in your comments.

    How much did you base your decision on the salesperson and the discounted offer, and how much on the system?

    From what you say the different systems offer quite different services. My understanding is that they are all basically the same.

    DVS removes moisture from each room. Well so will all the others if you install a vent in each room like you have with DVS.

    We keep our doors closed at night. Fine, but then you pay extra for extra vents in each room. The type of system does not matter.

    DVS has a better filtration system for allegies. Is that what the DVS salesman told you?

    They do not provide heated air. Well they do indirectly by removing moisture, and to an extent they do directly by slightly warming the air as it circulates. Each model will have options for having a heating gadget installed (basically a glorified light bulb). You can choose that or not by paying a little more for a more advanced unit.

    I'm not trying to knock your decision, rather to question the grounds on which you made it.

    xris
    Last edited by xris; 22-07-2007 at 08:32 AM.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    1,129

    Default

    I've never understood why people spend $1000-$1500 to install these systems.
    You can achieve the same result by opening a window at each end of your house and letting the wind blow through.
    Nett result - the moist air is removed and your house is colder.
    I certainly don't believe the claim that "warm air from your ceiling cavity" is pumped into the house.
    At 11pm on a winters night, my ceiling cavity is about 1C. The interior of my fridge is warmer.

  7. #17

    Default

    How much did you base your decision on the salesperson and the discounted offer, and how much on the system?

    No, the HRV system was still more expensive than the DVS system. My decision was purely based on the fact that we close out doors at night and I don't know how DVS would work when the doors are closed. The sales guy didn't give me a good enough explanation.

    From what you say the different systems offer quite different services. My understanding is that they are all basically the same.

    The systems are essentially the same but they differentiate with each other
    a. MM - In line heater
    b. DVS - price
    c. HRV - Heating from roof

    With all the systems you can choose options that will make them exactly the same.

    DVS removes moisture from each room. Well so will all the others if you install a vent in each room like you have with DVS.

    I went with HRV. HRV says you NEED a vent in every room. DVS & MM say you DON'T. Hence the system is cheaper.

    We keep our doors closed at night. Fine, but then you pay extra for extra vents in each room. The type of system does not matter.

    Yes see above

    DVS has a better filtration system for allegies. Is that what the DVS salesman told you?

    HRV does and yes the standard DVS system is not as good as the standard HRV (which cost more). You can add a better filter to the DVS system to make it equivalent to the HRV one and this the DVS guy accepted.

    They do not provide heated air. Well they do indirectly by removing moisture, and to an extent they do directly by slightly warming the air as it circulates. Each model will have options for having a heating gadget installed (basically a glorified light bulb). You can choose that or not by paying a little more for a more advanced unit.

    HRV says there is heat in your roof. I'm just letting everyone know that in my roof its colder at night and if you think about it.. if a place gets hotter faster it will get colder faster as well.

    Yes the air is dryer and fresher.

    I'm not trying to knock your decision, rather to question the grounds on which you made it.

    Take it or leave it, its my experience having gone thru this. If it helps someone with their decision good on them.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    4,760

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tricky View Post
    I've never understood why people spend $1000-$1500 to install these systems.
    You can achieve the same result by opening a window at each end of your house and letting the wind blow through.
    Nett result - the moist air is removed and your house is colder.
    I certainly don't believe the claim that "warm air from your ceiling cavity" is pumped into the house.
    At 11pm on a winters night, my ceiling cavity is about 1C. The interior of my fridge is warmer.
    Last week, when the sun was out and the air temperature was around 12-14 degrees, the air in the roof space was between 20 and 28, and the house was noticeably warmer than similar days before we installed Moisture Master.

    Opening the windows is fine, except for the

    a. howling gale
    b. extra noise from the road outside.
    c. rain

    that accompanies the 'dry' air.

    xris - one thing that was interesting about the various sales staff that we spoke to was that they all spoke to their particular system's strengths. When challenged about, e.g. heating or filtering offered by others, they would acknowledge that their system was not equivalent, but that the benefits outweighed the negatives.

    All in all, it was interesting how knowledgeable the sales people were about their opposition.

    The Moister Master website (www.condensation.co.nz) has a useful FAQ that goes through most of the objections to their system (and therefore the principles involved in all systems of this type).

    cube
    DFTBA

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Auckland
    Posts
    3,936

    Default

    Warning:

    Buy this type of system on the basis of moisture control only.


    Any slight heating effect treat as a bonus and you won't be disappointed.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    368

    Default

    I have been through a lengthly process to decide which system was best for our house. Everyones needs are different.

    Condensation was not such a problem with us as we live in a draughty old house - we wanted even heat through the house and good filtration as we live near orchards.

    The HRV specifications won hands down. They have a 3 year money back guarantee and stand by their product.

    These are the reason we went with HRV.

    * The filter is below the fan. Other companies have the filter above the fan - to protect the fan, not the people living in the house. The HRV filter filters to .8 of a micron which didn't mean much to me but apparently 80 microns is a human hair. The other systems have filter similar to a vacuum cleaner - not nearly enough to filter out pollens, sprays, polution and bacteria. This was a huge issue with the allergies we have.

    * The HRV Controller is more advanced. You can see at any time what temperature is in the roof. Even on overcast days our roof gets to 21 degrees and our core temperature of our home has risen from 11 on a frosty morning to 17 degrees at the lowest. I would challenge anyone that says there is no heat in your roof during the day in winter. If its cooling your house down at night then call the person who sold it to you as they can be adjusted.

    The controller slows down at night so you do not need a heater in the roof cavity,. The reason other products have heaters up there is because their controller doesn't turn the fan down when its cold up there. Whats the point of heating 7 degree air in the roof when the system has blown 24 degree air all day into your home? It is more efficient to top up the air already warmed. HRV never say they replace the heating in your home. They say conservatively 40 - 60% of your heating is supplied for 12 cents per day, per fan.

    The reason it costs only 12 cents per day is because it is an 85watt fan that doesn't blow full bore all day - just the times the roof is warmer than your home. I think this is the main selling point of HRV - low cost for getting 40 to 60% of your home heating - fantastic.

    * Customer service and knowledge and the product guarantee.

    * Number of vents and it being "positive pressure". HRV stops draughts because it is causing a positive pressure in your home. The air is pushed through cracks,etc and dust and smells are pushed out too.

    * "burnt toast mode". IF you burn toast or cook fish you can press a button and get 10 air changes per hour for one hour. It totally clears out the house of my smelly cooking!

    * Cooling at night in the summer and you can put a summer kit on if you want. During the summer the roof cools down faster than your home so it blows cool air into your bedrooms at night, lowering humidity and making it possible to leave your windows closed - no mosquitos or burglars.

    The summer kits take cool air from the south side of the house during the day in summer and blow it through your house.

    If you are looking for a ventilation product ask the sales person what the filter filters down to, how many air changes per hour the product gives you and whether they can guarantee positive air pressure if you only have 2 vents. (any one got teenage children who keep the bedroom door closed all the time? How is a vent in the hallway going to keep this room dry and smell free?). Don't forget the guarantee....

    This is my two cents worth - as I have said - I have done alot of research before deciding on HRV.

    Oh - and if you are turning your HRV off you are doing your house a dis-service by thinking opening the windows is better. The warmer, dryer air in the room cavity and HRV system will give you more air changes than just leaving the windows open - and also - if you want to open the windows you can - just leave the HRV on as well.

    Hope this helps save someone some time when deciding which system to install.
    Last edited by rueben; 02-08-2008 at 03:57 PM.


 

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